My Shelby FE 427 is finally back home

[Eric S]

After almost 8 years, not a typo, yes 8 years, and 4 Engine builders involved, I finally had my engine dyno tested and it seems to work well.
Now I am cleaning everything, ordering some new parts as several ARP bolts I ordered when started rebuilding the engine has vanished...
Also trying to determine why the starter motor that was replaced 10.000 miles ago is already damaged (PowerMaster guys are quite helpfull by the way)

When we tested the engine, the tech had to redo the front & rear gaskets on the intake as a leak developped. At first he used the supplied paper gasket and finally cut thinner ones in paper gasket so as to end up with a thinner space (and less paste) on the front & rear but I fear I still have a little leak unless it was some oil left from previous leak...
Also the oil pan (cork) gasket sounds strange as it looks like I have two gaskets in place (with paste). Strange as I gave the shop only 1 gasket.

Several details to sort out.
No wonder I am now building the engines myself (1 MGC 3 Liters, 1 Chevy 350, 1 Douglas 1937 motorbike in the works). Quite long (not longer though) but at least I know what's in.

Not a lot of engine builders here, and as I already explained to Dave, not any FE Specialist.

Well, it was just a quick message to follow up with some messages and questions I asked a few years ago about that engine where Dave already helped.
I may come back with more questions here later....

[Eric S]

Found those little parts in a box.
Any idea what they might be?
Dowels are .37" x 1/2"
Studs are maybe 3/8" x 5"

I can't remember having removed them myself. Probably one of the 4 guys that worked on the engine did.

EDIT Found the studs on an old picture, they were made by the mechanic #1 to hold the engine on its engine stand!

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[Eric S]

When the machine shop dyno tested the engine, they installed a M10x100 oil pressure adapter (left on the picture) in the block when a NPT was originally (right on the picture). Now I need to use my connector (to link the line on the car) and it won't thread of course now that the threads has been butchered.
I can helicoil the thread to 10Mx100 and get a new adapter that will fit my line.
I can also Helicoil to 3/8 or 7/16 UNC.
I don't think I can use a NPT thread anymore??

BUT I need to identify the thread on the other side, where it connects to the line. Thread is .305"/7.7mm. Pitch seems to be 24-25 Tpi. Difficult to measure on 4-5 threads only.
Engine having been assembled in the US, I don't think there is a metric thread.

Also what is the name of this adaptor so I can try to look for it?

I don't see any other solution to solve this problem??

EDIT
I went and order a new adapter. At 50$, it was not worth spending money on taps, adapters, ...

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[Eric S]

Replacing the offset oil filter adapter on the block.
IMG_20250331_160133_424.jpg
It came with paper gasket.
Shall I use a product on (both sides of) paper?
Also what do we use on the threads of pressure sender and oil lines (tape teflon or PTFR paste)?

Same regarding the expansion tank on the block. Paper gasket is installed dry or with shellac?
IMG_20250329_144711_222.jpg

[pbf777]

Replacing the offset oil filter adapter on the block.
It came with paper gasket.
Shall I use a product on (both sides of) paper?

Since the block and adapter surfaces seem to be new, smooth without surface imperfections, I'd generally just utilize a reasonable gasket without any additional sealer.

Same regarding the expansion tank on the block. Paper gasket is installed dry or with shellac?

Here I will generally utilize one's preferred sealer, but conservatively.

Also what do we use on the threads of pressure sender and oil lines (tape teflon or PTFR paste)?

Either is popularly used, but one thing to remember is that teflon acts as a solid lubricant and has led to the destruction of many a part (particularly those of aluminum) due to unintentional over torquing. Also, when the connection extensions are made to these fittings, even though one is suppose to utilize two wrenches (one for the turning effort & the other as a holding stay for the adapter), but particularly when teflon tape is utilized often the adapter to housing juncture proves to be the most susceptible to rotation (unless over torqued on the initial installation) and this can lead to difficulties. So if the adapter is intended to be (semi) permanent, perhaps one might choose to utilize something with a chemical locking feature (e.g. Locktite).

Also remember: 'NO' dry threading into aluminum! Lubricant, sealer or Locktite,....................but something other than dry threading!

Scott.

[60birdaussie]

Either use of Loctite 577 in a tube or Loctite 542 in a bottle, for metal pipe fittings whether aluminium or steel. I use them on aircraft air cooled engines and they work very well. Use a good solvent like acetone or if you don't have that, a good quality brake cleaner to clean threads of fittings before application of these compounds.

[Eric S]

Thank you for your replies.
For now, I am still checking some areas of concern (for me, so I have to ask around if what concerns me is legit or not)
I discovered some tiny black metal parts under a rocker cover (just one) and no way to find where this comes from. All spring, retainers, cups are fine. They were about the size of bits of metal when you use a steel saw on a piece of metal or maybe a bit smaller.
Then I dip a magnetic screwdriver tip through the plug on the oil pan, wiped it on a white piece of paper and using a magnet under the paper, I managed to drag a pair of very small fillings so I am in the process of pulling the oil pan just ot make sure there is not much more.
This morning I cut open the oil filter and found no metallic fillings (did not react with magnet) but the oil seems to be greyish with some very small "flakes". The engine and pistons are aluminum so I am wondering if those are normal break-in witnesses?
The oil filter ran 2 hours on the bench when we dyno tested the engine.

I will check the cylinder condition when oil pan will be down...
The journey continues...

In the meantime is there any better oil pan gasket between cork, composite or felcoid?
My engine has a plate sandwiched between pan and block. It was installed between 2 what looks like regular cork gaskets.
And what is the torque required to turn the engine (with no spark plugs). It turns fine but I have some hard compression (?) points. Would like to check that too.

[pbf777]

The finding of "some" small particulate adrift in the oil or particularly captured in the oil filter is not considered "unusual" (that's why there's a filter in the first place), particularly in a new build, on initial break-in. The decision as to that which would be considered acceptable or not, is established through the understanding of what is being presented and what is to be expected, this with experienced observation. But I would say that if upon inspection of the opened-up oil filter assembly nothing alarming was found, I probably wouldn't feel it was necessary to tear into the engine in search of a potential problem . . . . . . yet.

If no other issues seem to have presented themselves, then with only "2 hours" of running time, I'd install new oil (still a "break-in" type) and filter and proceed with the business of running-in the engine for a period; then pull the filter, cut it open and see what might be present. Generally, if something is going south, of a concerning nature, upon cutting open the oil filter and inspecting the filter media, you won't be in doubt.

B.T.W. I'm not there, but often a "molly" type assembly lube is utilized in the build process, and this results in a non-magnetic, silvery sheen material (looks like a fine metallic in paint), adrift in the oil and will continue to be displayed in future oil changes, in diminishing sums, until it all is finally "washed-out".

Scott.

[Eric S]

Thank you Scott
One of the shops involved used a black greasy assembly lube. Being black it may well be molly based.
I have not find anything really wrong.
Cylinders as viewed from the bottom seems fine.
The hard spot I had when turning the engine seems to be the fuel pump !
Today I receied the new cork gaskets. I will install everything back over the week-end.
Then I will use the break-in oil Crower recommends with ZDDP additive to bring the Zinc levels up to about 2.000ppms.

I preferred to be safe and checked a bit further. I know I am asking too much questions but as I am not an expert, I want to make sure I don't miss an obvious problem...

[pbf777]

I (and many others) consider utilizing a proper oil, rather than an oil requiring an additive in order to be acceptable; this as in discussion efforts I've had in the past with persons in the oil industry whom have cautioned that, it is an unknown, if when pouring an "additive" into the oil volume whether it will prove to actually be totally miscible in the solution, therefore the value of such additives must be tempered with the understanding of such vs. the claim on the product label.

Scott.

[Eric S]

I am not a big fan of aditives either, I buy the oil directly from a manufacturer so I can make sure of the oil specs. They plan to make a high Zinc oil because of high demand but this is just a plan. For now I am using Hamilton Camshield. It increases ZDDP 800ppm for 14 onces in 1 quart. The standard classic engine oil I use has 800ppm so I can bring the ZDDP to where I want it. I don’t feel that there is any miscible concern but will ask around.

[Eric S]

I am preparing at re-installing the oil Pan and tray.
Got 2 cork gaskets from FelPro.
Will use any of those products.
IMG_20250425_172959_438.jpg

Now it's a bit tricky as the oil pump's pick up tube is bolted on the tray.
So my plan is to install the tray with 1 gasket. Paste on block/gasket's 2 faces, top of tray. Hold it in place with the pan and bolts so the pan "glue" to the block.
IMG_20250428_114902_452.jpg
Then install the pick up tube

Then the oil pan with paste on tray/gasket's 2 faces, top of oil pan for a final installation.
Following Dave's recommandations (hand tight + 1/4 turn and Loctite)
IMG_20250428_114850_857.jpg

Any help is welcome as I really would hate to have a leak there...

[pbf777]

I would probably not use either gasket sealer product you have shown; I feel one is not actually a very good "sealer" and remains gooey never actually "setting-up", and the other I don't feel would be ideal for this application where the gaskets aren't going to take a set for period and that before this happens this product will become too rigid and with the lack of pliability will fail to provide the sealing properties when the gasket moves.

Also, speaking of the gasket moving, this issue is that particularly "cork" gaskets (and in this case you have double the trouble!) tend to accept the compressed positioning post clamping, this meaning that the sealing force they are intended to apply against the surfaces they contact is to a certain degree lost, and since they are sensitive to being overly clamped (squashed) in the initial fastener torquing, it is commonly practiced to need to "re-torque" them, often repeatedly, but gently, until they finally take a set: and this is where a pliable, non-hardening sealer is required; and also 'no' Loctite applied to the fasteners either!

Scott.

[Eric S]

I tried to look around and found nothing consensual. Going from bare to all different kind of products, including Vaseline.
What would you recommend then?

[pbf777]

Permatex "Ultra-Black" . . . . . . . sparingly.

Scott.