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oil pressure problem on a 430

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  • #16
    Originally posted by simplyconnected View Post
    ...Buy a cheap oil gauge and screw it into one of the oil plugs on the side. If the drill motor turns hard, you should see lots of pressure on the gauge.
    How many psi are you getting?
    Originally posted by simplyconnected View Post
    ...I suggest you pull your rocker arm shafts off... ...Before re-assembly, run your 1/2" drill motor in reverse on the oil pump drive shaft, and see if oil comes up to each head...
    What oil did you see when you pulled the rocker shafts?
    If your problems are on top, it doesn't make sense to do cam bearings. - Dave
    My latest project:
    CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

    "We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
    --Lee Iacocca

    From: Royal Oak, Michigan

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    • #17
      Dave got oil out of the at number 1 and number 5 should I be getting more? Just removed a plug out of the hole over number 1 and got oil there. Should there be a plug there? By the way I got 60lbs of oil pressure.
      Mike

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      • #18
        Follow the oil ...

        never worked on a MEL engine, but from a quick goggle search it says same oiling system as the FE. That being the case, I would do as Dave suggested. If you have oil at the rocker stand bolt holes check to make sure that the bolts in those holes are the necked down ones to allow oil flow. Then follow Daves directions. Good hunting, Mike

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        • #19
          Do you know if the bolts are different from each other? Just read about some bolts with sides cut out of them. Also does anyone know the best oil for these engines. I been reading about Rotella because of the lack of zink in other oil's. Any Thoughts

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          • #20
            Bolts ...

            the aftermarket studs I use on FE's have two necked down studs for the stands that supply oil to the shafts. The stock bolts may be all the same size. To check torque down the other three bolts and put the oil supply bolt in but leave it a couple of turns loose. If you get oil flow out around the bolt head you should be good to go. If memory serves you should be able to move the rocker stand side to side with the bolt in loose. I use Rotella in all my flat tappet engines, but you should still use a zinc additive. Hope this helps. Mike
            Last edited by gaffney1951; December 4th, 2011, 10:03 PM.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by skikemp View Post
              Do you know if the bolts are different from each other? Just read about some bolts with sides cut out of them...
              Pardon my frustration, but if you had attempted to follow my suggestion (taking pictures along the way) many of your questions would be answered, you would have a better understanding of the system, you would have actually inspected all the parts for wear, and you probably would have fixed all your oiling issues for FREE.

              Mike Gaffney is correct on all points regarding the MEL/FE oiling system and rocker shafts. Any engine this old needs attention and should at least be cleaned and inspected or it may not work for very long. If we see your pictures, we will all identify something that isn't right.

              Per your request, here is my phone number:
              (248) 544-8834
              I also wrote a PM to you with my number included. Call anytime, or give me YOUR number and I will call you. - Dave Dare
              My latest project:
              CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

              "We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
              --Lee Iacocca

              From: Royal Oak, Michigan

              Comment


              • #22
                Sorry

                Dave
                Thank you for your responce and I meant no disrespect, When I got this motor it was a complete rebuilt longblock so clean parts where not an issue, everything was new. My finding was a screw in plug in the left in the head by the machinist who rebuilt the motor. Agian I Thank you all your help I have leaned alot along the way. My number is 360-507-3674
                Mike
                Last edited by skikemp; December 5th, 2011, 09:42 AM.

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                • #23
                  Mike, I called your number a few minutes ago but it went to voice mail. (So, I left a message.) - Dave
                  My latest project:
                  CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

                  "We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
                  --Lee Iacocca

                  From: Royal Oak, Michigan

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Problem Solved!!!!

                    Hey Guys
                    Thank you for all the help!!!! After pulling the rocker arms I found the problem, A plug in the oil galley left by the machinist, don't know why but after pulling it I have 65 lbs of pressure and it runs great. Check out the picture. Thanks again
                    Mike
                    Attached Files

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                    • #25
                      Mike & I discussed this situation, after Mike found the problem on his own. Only one head had threads in the oil hole, and that head was plugged with a set screw.

                      I remember posts about limiting the oil supply to FE heads. They would drill a hole in a set screw and thread it into this oil hole.

                      I think Mike bought an engine that was partially done. They tapped one head but never drilled the set screw's oil hole (orfice). They left the RH head stock. Since Mike is running a high volume oil pump, it doesn't matter if the heads get extra oil flow, so he is leaving the set screw out. I agree.

                      Another issue is the two 'special' undercut bolts for oil stantions. He has none. All of Mike's bolts are identical. Mike says he will take pictures of the stantions (to show machined oil passages, I think). I'm anxious to see them. - Dave

                      EDIT: I found it...
                      "Oiling System
                      Early 428 Cobra Jet Mustangs had oiling problems because with only 5 quarts in the passenger car pan, 3 quarts were circulating in the engine while it was running, and a hard launch would shoot the remaining 2 quarts to the back of the engine away from the pickup, resulting in bearing carnage. To save your FE from oil starvation death, you must use a good oil pan and windage tray, have 6 quarts of oil in the 5-quart pan, and restrict the oil flow to the rocker arms."

                      I knew I read it somewhere. These guys are using a standard oil pump, too.
                      Last edited by simplyconnected; December 7th, 2011, 02:14 AM.
                      My latest project:
                      CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

                      "We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
                      --Lee Iacocca

                      From: Royal Oak, Michigan

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Oil restriction ...

                        I run a high volume Melling pump on all of my FE's along with a 7-8 qt pan, windage tray, and restrict the the oil passages to .070 to prevent flooding on the top end. That being said, these are high performance builds and the stock engines seemed to run just fine as built. The restrictors due not have to be threaded into the head. you can use a holley carb jet of the appropriate size or a piece of drilled round stock. If you have excessive rocker and shaft wear you could have problems flooding the the heads and if not using positive valve guide seals (not a factory item) this will lead to oil consumption, smoking exh., and carbon deposits on valves and pistons. Mike

                        Last edited by gaffney1951; December 7th, 2011, 07:23 AM.

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                        • #27
                          YES!!! Aluminum heads with STUDS & nuts holding the rocker shafts. This is the setup everyone should enjoy. It costs around $1,500 but well worth every penny.

                          I can't say enough good things about these heads:
                          Pre-ignition and detonation - GONE
                          Higher compression ratios (for much higher HP) - any time you like
                          Heat transfer - a natural with aluminum
                          Exhaust Seats - Hardened for today's gasolines
                          Valve Stem Seals - made with spring-loaded Viton (not those cheap OEM umbrellas that don't work)
                          Valves - Stainless Steel for today's gasolines
                          Springs - new, so they resist bounce and floating valves
                          Valve Guides- Manganese Bronze (the right stuff for Stainless stems, and they last)

                          You can spend as much on your cast iron heads, but aluminum works so much better and all the parts are precision finished with the right materials (something they didn't have back in the day).

                          Marry these heads with a 1961 mild street cam and a true roller chain, and instantly breathe ~400-hp in your 390. If you have a little extra cash, pop for the aluminum intake manifold and save at least 40 more pounds under the hood. You can subtract over 100-lbs weight by using aluminum heads and intake, then ADD big ponies by raising your compression ratio to 10:1. This combination makes a HUGE difference in your Thunderbird's performance and steering/braking agility.

                          Beautiful Edelbrock setup, Mike Gaffney. - Dave
                          Last edited by simplyconnected; December 7th, 2011, 09:24 PM.
                          My latest project:
                          CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

                          "We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
                          --Lee Iacocca

                          From: Royal Oak, Michigan

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by skikemp View Post

                            Do you know if the bolts are different from each other? Just read about some bolts with sides cut out of them. Also does anyone know the best oil for these engines. I been reading about Rotella because of the lack of zink in other oil's.

                            Any Thoughts
                            All of the MEL rocker stand bolts are the same and not necked down. This was a feature on some FE HIPO engines to insure oil flow @ HI-RPM (Solid tappets would maybe not require these). One would have to monitor oil flow volume to the valve train to insure adequate but not excessive oil supply, especially for a solid HP engine.

                            There was a thread on another forum where a MEL teardown found necked down rocker stand bolts @ the oil supply positions. It was determined these were modified (not OEM) to insure adequate oil supply to the shafts. Most likely there was a supply problem and this was the method used to insure more volume.

                            As for modern engine oil (SL-SM-SN), there is no high zinc content oil available (despite advertising claims) other than racing oil or restricted use diesel oil. Find the best quality 10W-30 or 10W-40 you can and add a proven zinc additive (or go roller).

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