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  #1  
Old 10-18-2016, 04:38 AM
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Default Couple of general questions 59 J-code

Wondering what color squarebirds air cleaners were factory. More importantly one on a 59 430. I've seen them in white, Black, blue and chrome.


Wondering the size/diameter of a 430 air cleaner. My problem is I bought an air cleaner for a 59 Thunderbird. The splurge tank sits front to back unlike a 352 or FEs that go from side to side. The indent for the tank in the air cleaner is not very big on the one I got and I must turn the word front towards the passenger side sort of like 6 0'clock to 7 O'clock. This air cleaner is huge and has all of the markings I have seen on other squarebird air cleaners. I got one from my buddy who has a 59 Edsel Ranger wagonthat came with a 332 FE it is smaller and doesn't have the markings but the indent is much bigger. His 332 BTW does not have the splurge tank.

Wondering if I should have a fan shroud. Not that I am overheating, as a matter of fact it stays consistent in temp.

Wondering where I might be able to pick up the dash piece that goes under the radio. I've never seen one but I have been told that some have map lights in them. I'd like to have one in general but even more I would like to have one with a map light.

Fly wheeel cover, I'm missing mine and would like to know where I can get one. Doesn't have to be fancy.

These are items I've been looking for and have not found.

For the 430 owners what size carb do you run on yours? What is too small or too big? I've seen 430s running dual carbs (sweet, marauder and Lincoln continental setups) seems like a lot of gas to dump in but it makes me wonder if a small carb would choke out.

The drivingbseason is coming to a close so I am going to start doing things to mine. Didn't want to touch too much and keep me down for long and miss car shows and cruise-ins.

Couple things on the list are super motor and checking out if I can get it working or buy an electric motor and not even attempt the vacuum. While I am at that I'd like to get my window washer working.
While I am doing that changing the heater core. I was doing a little reading and saw you basically have to take out the glove box to get at everything. My heater core looks like it might be a simple change in the outside firewall.

Relating to the carb question, seems like I have a dead spot in mine if you give it too much gas too quick it will hesitate, but driving normally it is just fine. Not that I'm a peel out type of guy, but I did try to see if it would squeal the tires and it doesn't even come close. I know it's a heavy car but it is a big engine. I feel it should have more power than it does. Highway speeds In fine. I can float down the highway 70-80 no problem. I have noticed some days it runs better than others though. Somedays it's perfect some days you have to be really easy in the pedal. I thought maybe because I had tuned it more for hot weather and some of the evenings cruising the temps dropped and thought it didn't like it. But I really don't think that is the case.

I've noticed my passenger vent window doesn't likebtobstay open unless you hold it open and since I don't have a/c yet it would be nice if it did. The drivers side stays open unless it's a really strong wind then it will close on its own. Hopefully there is an adjustment screw some place to fix that issue.
So besides paint this is my to do list.

Oh and another thing the pricing of buying these cars are all over the place. I just don't understand it. I saw Barry Goldwaters squarebird with super low miles something like 32k and itbwas up for sale for less than $10k. I see cars like that all the time and shake my head. There is no way I would let mine go anywhere near these prices. Besides the money that I got into getting this car and the couple grand I put in it since I got it(all new front end bushings, plugs, wires coil, cap rotor and other tune up items) and besides the money for the stuff in he to do list the next 3 things on the list, Paint, factory A/C setup, spokes and wide whites is going to be over $6k and that's not even looking up pricing for rechroming bumpers and other chrome parts. Is this too much money to put into a car? My body is rock solid needs very little work to be prepped for paint, but then these ones I see for cheap look super solid as well.
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  #2  
Old 10-18-2016, 10:59 AM
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The correct color of the air cleaner is Colonial White. All squarebirds were painted that color unless they had the optional chrome dress up kit.

Even though the air cleaners look the same the 430 air cleaners had different indents as you mentioned. If you don't want to modify yours then look for an air cleaner from a Lincoln 430/462.

If your car doesn't overheat then I wouldn't worry about installing a shroud unless you want it for safety reasons.

Contact Carl Heller (partsetal) about the radio plate and flywheel cover. Only convertibles had the map light so they may be difficult to find. You can certainly modify a plain one by cutting the holes out. The lenses are available.

Do you have the original Carter AFB carb? If you have a dead spot you should replace the accelerator pump. For a replacement I would get an Edelbrock 1406. It looks identical to the Carter and is designed for modern fuels.

The vent windows have a pivot pin that can wear. You can remove them by removing the two small set screws and pulling it out. You may be able to spread the pivot pin so it is tighter.

As for pricing the 430 really doesn't add a lot as far as value. Really nice coupes have kind of bottomed out in the $8000-12000 range. It's a buyers market so if you are thinking of selling I wouldn't dump alot of money into it that you will never get back.

Hope I've answered some of your questions.

John
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Last edited by jopizz : 10-18-2016 at 12:17 PM.
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  #3  
Old 10-18-2016, 12:39 PM
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YellowRose YellowRose is offline
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Default Couple of general questions 59 J-code

The information for making and adding a map light to the bottom of the radio is in the Technical Resource Library. I used it to create a map light for my YellowRose hardtop to light up the long stem yellow rose in the center of my center console. The link to the TRL is always part of my signature element and that of John's ~ jopizz. Here is a pic of what it looks like completed.
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File Type: jpg SquarebirdMapLight.jpg (34.8 KB, 115 views)
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Old 10-18-2016, 01:06 PM
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Mine has the 352 but I'm currently running a 430 style air cleaner.

If the Carter carb is the same as the Ford 4100 the air cleaner will only fit one way. On the 4100 there are notches in the carb that conform to tabs on the air cleaner.

I've seen quite a few listings showing later Galaxie air cleaners as being the same as the Tbird but they are not. Probably fit the carb but shaped different.

In the picture the one on the left is the original air cleaner for my 352. Notice it has "FRONT" stamped on the housing, an indent in the back at the top and the snorkel is one size out to the end.

On the right is a 430 style (not 100% certain it was from a Tbird but believe so - can't remember if this is the one I bought from Carl - if it is then you can be sure it's right)
Anyway - it also has "FRONT" stamped in the housing, NO indent on the back at the top and the snorkel widens at the end to connect to the heat riser plenum. Don't believe the air cleaner needs any indentations to clear the expansion tank only the front indentation under the air cleaner housing to clear the distributor.




(and yes the chrome valve cover on the right is a cheap aftermarket with the '55-'57 312 emblem but I just like it)

John - did all 430 Tbirds have the heat riser connected from the air cleaner to the exhaust manifold?


Here are a couple of pics snagged from the web



This one has the indentation on the top rear so maybe that is the difference between the Lincoln 430 air cleaner and the Tbird 430 air cleaner????

Which is Lincoln and which is Tbird. Can't really tell in the brochure pic above.



Hard to tell about the indent on this one.


Has the rear indent so maybe the indent is specific to the Tbird??
http://cdn.barrett-jackson.com/stagi...Engine_Web.JPG
Eric

Last edited by YellowRose : 10-24-2016 at 06:31 PM. Reason: Pic to big, but here is the link...
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Old 10-18-2016, 01:51 PM
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Vent Window:
The side pin on the vent window is adjustable so you can center the glass vertically in the opening. This is merely a pivot point.
The top pin is a split tapered pin with a set screw in the center of the sleeve. As you tighten the set screw, it spreads the split sleeve and causes enough friction to keep the vent window open at highway speeds. The split top pin also fits inside a nylon bushing in the frame. If tightening the set screw a small amount doesn't firm up the window, I would remove the glass and see if the bushing is still in tact.
Nyles
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Old 10-18-2016, 03:48 PM
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Thanks guys great information. I love this group and read a lot of things in it. Just a wealth of knowledge, well worth the money to be a paid member.
If my pictures uploaded properly from my Phone it will show how my air cleaner sits on the carb. Sits at an angle slightly but will sit evenlywhen tightened down. I don't think I want to put oil in it as someone told me they are oil bath air cleaners. All I can imagine is constantly spilling it driving or working on it.

I have an edelbrock carb I believe it's a 7000 series. I will get the number of it when I get home. I'm able to start my 59 usually without even touching the gas pedal and it just sits there and purrs. Only under load driving does it have the flat spot. For the most part it does it only when giving it too much gas to quickly.
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File Type: jpg IMG_1719.jpg (295.0 KB, 114 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_1718.jpg (345.0 KB, 119 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_1717.jpg (261.5 KB, 113 views)
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Old 10-18-2016, 07:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Djweaz View Post
Thanks guys great information. I love this group and read a lot of things in it. Just a wealth of knowledge, well worth the money to be a paid member.
If my pictures uploaded properly from my Phone it will show how my air cleaner sits on the carb. Sits at an angle slightly but will sit evenlywhen tightened down. I don't think I want to put oil in it as someone told me they are oil bath air cleaners. All I can imagine is constantly spilling it driving or working on it.
These are NOT oil bath air cleaners so please do not put oil in it.

John
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Old 10-19-2016, 01:51 AM
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Woo hoo that would have been an uh oh.
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Old 10-24-2016, 06:22 PM
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Rob - just getting back to this thread and I see what you mean about your air cleaner sitting at a strange angle.

I'm thinking it must be that the replacement carb is shorter than the original and lets the air cleaner sit too low??? Notice how in the last pic I posted (found on the web) the air cleaner snorkel sticks out over the valve cover.

Here's a link to the picture because it's too big to re-post in the thread.
http://cdn.barrett-jackson.com/stagi...Engine_Web.JPG

Eric
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Old 10-25-2016, 08:33 AM
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My stock Carter'd 430 has an accel problem, dead spot also. I rebuilt carb and it does appear to be working correctly, I don't think is it a jet, metering rod, or accel pump problem, as the carb is original and should not be mis-sized.

The owner before me retarded timing massively to run reg gas. Just bumping it to stock specs and dumping 93 in got me 70% better. I would check that first. I still have not checked mech and vac advances to see if they are all working right, but it is in my plans.

Point being is it may not be the carb at all, although if someone did dump just a stock modern day edelbrock on a 430, it will may be "undercarbed" from a metering rod and maybe jets standpoint too.
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