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  #11  
Old 12-03-2012, 09:41 AM
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the fan controller came complete with a nice-looking fuse housing. I mounted it where my battery used to be.
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  #12  
Old 12-03-2012, 12:21 PM
RustyNCa RustyNCa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dakota Boy View Post
the fan controller came complete with a nice-looking fuse housing. I mounted it where my battery used to be.
How did you get that controller working right? I was running the same controller with their dual fan setup, and after fighting it, redoing the wiring, thinking it's working correctly and almost melting down my 455 a few times, I gave up and am now running a dash toggle switch and two large 50 amp relays. I have bypassed that setup, the idea would be great if I could trust the silly thing.

Cheers
RustyNCA
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  #13  
Old 12-03-2012, 12:51 PM
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Did you have the temp. sensor that reads the coolant temp. directly, or did you have the sensor that gets poked into the fins on the radiator?

I've got the sensor that mounts in the port on top of the water neck.

There's lots of write-ups on the internet where guys have used the Ford Contour dual fan with this FAL controller.
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  #14  
Old 12-03-2012, 02:34 PM
RustyNCa RustyNCa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dakota Boy View Post
Did you have the temp. sensor that reads the coolant temp. directly, or did you have the sensor that gets poked into the fins on the radiator?

I've got the sensor that mounts in the port on top of the water neck.

There's lots of write-ups on the internet where guys have used the Ford Contour dual fan with this FAL controller.
I have the one that goes into the rad. My problems didn't seem to be with it, but with the controller working sometimes and not at other times.

I don't know if it's a short inside the controller or what the problem is, but some days it would work great, others it would seem to be working, then about the time I am halfway across town, I see the car is starting to overheat. Pull over and yep, the fans aren't running, so I would have to by pass the controller to get the fans running. I would triple check the wiring, it's all good, and ironically the fans sometimes would be working again.

I called Flex-a-lite about it, all they told me, "You can purchase another one from us, we won't warranty it" Yeah, I want to purchase another one at $180 or whatever it was to replace the one that came with the whole setup I bought for $400 or $500.

My solution was to buy a relay for each fan, run those to a switch under the dash that lights up when it is on and working, and I now only have to worry about forgetting to flip the switch.

What frustrated me the most, I would go all through it, test it in the shop, have the car sit there and idle, watch it all work perfect, drive it around the block, yep, it's all still working. Then the wife would take the car out because, she loves driving it, and call me panicking because the **** thing is overheating again, after I told her I got it all fixed.

So I used the same setup I have been running on our 29 coupe which has yet to fail me

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  #15  
Old 12-03-2012, 02:45 PM
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Sounds like you got a bad controller, thats for sure.

Hopefully I will have better luck...
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  #16  
Old 12-03-2012, 03:32 PM
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Sounds to me like your thermostat isn't sensing because the cores you have it next to are cooling down when you get wind. Or, the thermostat isn't tight against a core.

Some cores are plugged or half-plugged on the inside. They cool down quickly. Usually it's the ones used the most (right next to your inlet pipe). Since water takes the path of least resistance, flow goes to another core farther away. You can prove this with one of those infrared guns but you have to run real fast in front of the car while it's going down the road. Just sitting there, all the cores conduct heat because the hot air is stagnant. I suppose you could blow a hefty fan in front to simulate 35-mph air flow while using the gun in the driveway.

I'm surprised factory boy didn't recognize this right away especially with a classic car. I had my rad out and filled it with phosphoric acid to break down the lime deposits. I had the rad flat with liquid covering the cores. Then I ran my propane torch over each rib quickly at first. The cores that are free will boil the liquid inside and you can hear bubbles through the cap and hose openings. The ones that are plugged don't boil. It's tricky. At the ends, the cores are normally somewhat open. Running heat along the core, it will boil until the obstruction, then it will stop. Because acid works much better with heat, I went back and forth dozens of times until the dang thing cleared itself, right and proper-like.

Nothing beats a recored copper radiator, but this helped quite a bit. BTW, Prestone has a anti-rust chemical. Yep! Phosphoric acid in a mild form. Once it gets used up, no more anti-corrosion/anti rust properties.

Many of the solid state controllers are current direction sensitive. They will destroy if current is reversed. That's why I like using bullet proof relay contacts. Let the solid state take care of small signal currents so relays can do the real work.

The correct placement for the thermostat is at the radiator. At the engine's thermostat, it's always hot by design.

There's another problem if the radiator isn't full of coolant. Water pumps pull from the bottom of the radiator. Even if the coolant level is half way down, it still pumps. I see nothing wrong with putting the thermostat closer to the bottom of the radiator where you KNOW the coolant is. If airflow works, the coolant will stay cool (and not call for the fan). If not, it's putting hot water back in your engine and the stick should sense that. - Dave
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  #17  
Old 12-06-2012, 05:59 PM
RustyNCa RustyNCa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simplyconnected View Post
Sounds to me like your thermostat isn't sensing because the cores you have it next to are cooling down when you get wind. Or, the thermostat isn't tight against a core.

Some cores are plugged or half-plugged on the inside. They cool down quickly. Usually it's the ones used the most (right next to your inlet pipe). Since water takes the path of least resistance, flow goes to another core farther away. You can prove this with one of those infrared guns but you have to run real fast in front of the car while it's going down the road. Just sitting there, all the cores conduct heat because the hot air is stagnant. I suppose you could blow a hefty fan in front to simulate 35-mph air flow while using the gun in the driveway.

I'm surprised factory boy didn't recognize this right away especially with a classic car. I had my rad out and filled it with phosphoric acid to break down the lime deposits. I had the rad flat with liquid covering the cores. Then I ran my propane torch over each rib quickly at first. The cores that are free will boil the liquid inside and you can hear bubbles through the cap and hose openings. The ones that are plugged don't boil. It's tricky. At the ends, the cores are normally somewhat open. Running heat along the core, it will boil until the obstruction, then it will stop. Because acid works much better with heat, I went back and forth dozens of times until the dang thing cleared itself, right and proper-like.

Nothing beats a recored copper radiator, but this helped quite a bit. BTW, Prestone has a anti-rust chemical. Yep! Phosphoric acid in a mild form. Once it gets used up, no more anti-corrosion/anti rust properties.

Many of the solid state controllers are current direction sensitive. They will destroy if current is reversed. That's why I like using bullet proof relay contacts. Let the solid state take care of small signal currents so relays can do the real work.

The correct placement for the thermostat is at the radiator. At the engine's thermostat, it's always hot by design.

There's another problem if the radiator isn't full of coolant. Water pumps pull from the bottom of the radiator. Even if the coolant level is half way down, it still pumps. I see nothing wrong with putting the thermostat closer to the bottom of the radiator where you KNOW the coolant is. If airflow works, the coolant will stay cool (and not call for the fan). If not, it's putting hot water back in your engine and the stick should sense that. - Dave
Well, I never thought to move the stat around in the core. Maybe I will have to give that a shot this summer.

The rad is pretty new, well, I put in the 4 core brass radiator that is there, I would think pretty soon after I bought the car, so now that I think about it, that is 10 to 12 years ago. Not much use on her during that time span.

Thanks for the idea.

RustyNCA
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  #18  
Old 12-07-2012, 06:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RustyNCa View Post
...Not much use on her during that time span...
Which begs the real question: What causes corrosion and rust inside your cooling system? Is it heat? Flow? Galvanic reaction? I don't know, either.

I do know that the phosphoric acid inside fresh antifreeze is a mild concentration that gets 'used up'. I think the green stuff (ethylene glycol) is supposed to last at least a couple years.

They designed the orange stuff to last much longer. NEVER mix the two in your system. It turns to mud and your engine WILL overheat because the pump can't move thick viscosity.

In the North, we depend on antifreeze but we're also guilty of making it last 'just another year' (which then turns into many years too long). Write the date on a sticker (like all garages did back in the day) to display the unbiased truth. We can't go by color because there is also a water pump lubricant in there. When buying antifreeze, you get the protection you pay for.

(I never buy 50/50 because I buy water much cheaper, and I know it's soft.) - Dave
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  #19  
Old 12-07-2012, 11:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simplyconnected View Post
Which begs the real question: What causes corrosion and rust inside your cooling system? Is it heat? Flow? Galvanic reaction? I don't know, either.

I do know that the phosphoric acid inside fresh antifreeze is a mild concentration that gets 'used up'. I think the green stuff (ethylene glycol) is supposed to last at least a couple years.

They designed the orange stuff to last much longer. NEVER mix the two in your system. It turns to mud and your engine WILL overheat because the pump can't move thick viscosity.

In the North, we depend on antifreeze but we're also guilty of making it last 'just another year' (which then turns into many years too long). Write the date on a sticker (like all garages did back in the day) to display the unbiased truth. We can't go by color because there is also a water pump lubricant in there. When buying antifreeze, you get the protection you pay for.

(I never buy 50/50 because I buy water much cheaper, and I know it's soft.) - Dave
I actually change it out every year in this car. I don't run any coolant in the car during the summer, I run distilled water mixed with water wetter only during the summer. Then put in the antifreeze for the winter. Drain it all out again in the spring, start the process over.

The water wetter with distilled water seems to run about 15- 20 degrees cooler than when there is antifreeze in there, at least with this motor.
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  #20  
Old 12-07-2012, 01:16 PM
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X2 on the Water Wetter.

Good stuff.
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