This will take you to the main site where there is history, technical information and other information on these cars.
This takes you back to the main page of the forums.
This is the control panel to change your password, information and preferences on this message board.
Click here if your lost your password or need to register on this message board. You must be a registered user to post. Registration is free.
Search this board for information you need.
Click here to buy cool Squarebirds mechandise.
Click here to support Squarebirds.org. For $20 annually receive 20mBytes webspace, a Squarebirds e-mail address and member's icon on the message board.
  #1  
Old 03-31-2011, 11:45 PM
davidmij davidmij is offline
Super-Experienced
 
Join Date: Jan 17 2011
Posts: 660
davidmij is on a distinguished road
Default Oil pan gasket on a 352

Hey T-bird friends. I'm replacing a leaky oil pan gasket on my 59, 352 automatic. I got the oil pan unbolted and loose. Do I have to raise the motor to pull the pan all the way out? I want to get at the oil pump and clean the screen too. (No such thing as a stupid question, just stupid people) That would be me. ;0)
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 04-01-2011, 01:52 AM
simplyconnected's Avatar
simplyconnected simplyconnected is offline
Slow Typist
 
Join Date: May 26 2009
Posts: 7,130
simplyconnected is on a distinguished road
Default

David, you can't believe how many ask this question. Follow this thread:
http://squarebirds.org/vbulletin/sho...t=10644&page=2

Read it through because it cautions about common disasters. JohnG has a great point about rotating the crank to the correct position to make room for the pan. Hope this helps. - Dave
__________________
My latest project:
CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

"We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
--Lee Iacocca
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-01-2011, 02:27 PM
davidmij davidmij is offline
Super-Experienced
 
Join Date: Jan 17 2011
Posts: 660
davidmij is on a distinguished road
Default

Thx Dave, according to the manual I'll need to unbolt the engine mounts and raise it about a 2x4. Disconnect the radiator top hose - turn the crank out of the way, and then I should have enough room to unbolt the oil pump. It says I'll also need a gasket for the oil pump, I'll call my store to order that now. The pan gasket I ordered is part rubber ($9.99). Do I need to use a gasket sealer like form-a-gasket with this? Is there anything I should look for while I have it open - you know, stuff that might give me some indication of any engine trouble, or problems? The engine has blow by, I think it's from the passenger side cylinder closest to the fire wall because that spark plug was very black and oily.
When I was a kid I replaced a broke engine mount on a V8 once, other than that this is all new ground to me so I just want to make sure I don't miss anything.
Also, can you tell me why the thread says "moved"?
thx again, David.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-01-2011, 03:13 PM
simplyconnected's Avatar
simplyconnected simplyconnected is offline
Slow Typist
 
Join Date: May 26 2009
Posts: 7,130
simplyconnected is on a distinguished road
Default

David, I moved the thread so others could easily find it. Your question is really about your engine. Many other model cars share your engine.

If I didn't add this before, I always put the car on jack stands first to give enough room underneath to work and to get it off the wheels.

When you raise the engine, since the car is not on any suspension, just the engine should move.

Again, read the other thread because it comes from the experiences of many mechanics, not just one guy who wrote a manual.

Wrenching on engines is not for the faint-hearted. Cleaning parts is no fun, either. But once you're done, a great sense of accomplishment and pride will really make you smile. So will the money you save by doing this work, yourself.

Spread a thin coat of RTV on your gasket and let it 'skin' before assembly. It's only there to fill small gaps. Do the same on all mating surfaces but be very sure the old gasket material is scraped off and the surface is oil-free before spreading the RTV. Too much RTV will squish out, go into your engine and clog up your oil system. 'Just enough' RTV will seal nicely and it will probably save your gasket if you dis-assemble in the future.

I have used Permatex #2 (non-hardening), Indian Head (shellac), and a host of others, all successfully. Then RTV came on the market and Ford started using it on oil pans (without gaskets) at the engine plants.

I always ask myself, 'What do the OEM's use?', every time I work on cars. If you stick close to that, you're on the right track. Hope this helps. Take your time doing this job. If you get frustrated, STOP! Go back later when you're in a better mood and not so tired. Things will start 'going your way'. - Dave Dare

EDIT: The day before you start, take your car to a quarter car wash and clean the engine bay underneath real well. Dirt and crud tend to hide bolt heads and get into everything.
__________________
My latest project:
CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

"We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
--Lee Iacocca

Last edited by simplyconnected : 04-01-2011 at 03:20 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-01-2011, 04:11 PM
davidmij davidmij is offline
Super-Experienced
 
Join Date: Jan 17 2011
Posts: 660
davidmij is on a distinguished road
Default

Thx Dave!
I wish I could have degreased the bottom first, but the brakes weren't really road worthy. I have the car on 4 blocks and the brakes disconnected for when I get ready to do them. I took the pan off last night, not too much trouble. A tap with a rubber mallet and it came loose pretty easy. I'll get my gaskets tomorrow so I'm just taking my time. The manual said I need to replace the gasket for the oil pump too so I called and added it to my order. I don't plan on having the car running any time soon so I just work on it here and there when I get a little time. I'll most likely raise the engine up tomorrow and go from there. It's nice to work on cars when it's "at your leisure" - I really enjoy it and agree that it's a very satisfying when your done and it's right. I'll get some "RTV" when I pickup the gaskets.
Really nice weather today and tomorrow, might have to go golf and leave the car rill next weekend!
Cheers!
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-01-2011, 04:41 PM
simplyconnected's Avatar
simplyconnected simplyconnected is offline
Slow Typist
 
Join Date: May 26 2009
Posts: 7,130
simplyconnected is on a distinguished road
Default

If this job is 'at your leisure', I would like you to hold off buying the pump gasket. Here's why:

I would like you to take the bottom plate off the pump and look closely at the rotors. These are supposed to be precision parts, hardened and ground.

Trouble comes when oil is sucked up to the pump before the filter, (which is how all engines work). Sometimes little pieces of metal get embedded in the pump rotors.

You can buy just the internal pump parts. They come as a 7-piece kit with a gasket. Check out MAC's <--click here
Search for COAE-6600-8KT for $24.
BTW, do NOT put any gasket sealer on the pump gasket.
__________________
My latest project:
CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

"We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
--Lee Iacocca
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-01-2011, 04:51 PM
tbird430's Avatar
tbird430 tbird430 is offline
Super-Experienced
 
Join Date: Jun 18 2007
Posts: 2,616
tbird430 is on a distinguished road
Thumbs up

Make sure your back tires are blocked good to keep that Bird in place. Also, before raising the motor, have your hood open (and make sure it clears everything in your garage/shop). I would also watch the space between the upper transmission bellhousing bolt and the plastic A/C case on the firewall- if your Bird has A/C.

Good luck.
__________________

The 1960 Ford Thunderbird. The WORLD'S most wanted car....

VTCI Member#6287.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 04-01-2011, 07:04 PM
davidmij davidmij is offline
Super-Experienced
 
Join Date: Jan 17 2011
Posts: 660
davidmij is on a distinguished road
Default

Thx gents, I'm guessing that the 7 piece kit is the same for several engines, at least that's what it looks like. It says "sorry, discontinued item" when I search by my car, but the part number you supplied gives me the kit for a 428. The discontinued one would have been OK for a 352, 390, or a 428. Eventually I want to rebuild the motor so I'll check out the pump and decide if I want to rebuild it now or not. I saw another thread (johnG's) with pix of a clogged screen and a cleaned one - that's kind of why I thought I would check it out. http://www.squarebirds.org/users/johng/OCC.htm
As for blocking the car; I have it on 4 jack stands with all the wheels off in my driveway. It's level and solid. I even put some un-split firewood rounds under the end I'm working on. A friend at work had a neighbor that had a car fall on him years ago in his driveway. By the time anyone noticed he was a goner. I've always been paranoid (which is good) about crawling under a car, or even a child going under after a ball or something. Better safe than sorry cuz' "stuff does happen".
No AC, not much to get in the way, but I will keep a close eye on it as I jack it up slooooowly. Then I'll put a couple of short chucks of 2x4 in between the mounts and engine and let it rest on those.
thx again, Dave
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 04-04-2011, 12:02 AM
Astrowing Astrowing is offline
Experienced
 
Join Date: Jul 22 2009
Posts: 469
Astrowing is on a distinguished road
Default

I put a new oil pump in mine and cleaned the screen and I saw a big improvement in oil pressure. I also put in a new pump drive shaft while I was down there.
__________________


CLICK HERE for Jim's web site
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-04-2011, 12:19 AM
davidmij davidmij is offline
Super-Experienced
 
Join Date: Jan 17 2011
Posts: 660
davidmij is on a distinguished road
Default

I had about 3/16" of gray sludge in the bottom of the pan, not sure what that means. Everything was quite dirty, I cleaned my pump really well. When I turn the pump drive shaft it pumps great now. I completely cleaned the screen and pumped gas, then turpentine through it. It's running clear now. I'm sure that will help a lot with my oil pressure too. Had to scrape away all the oil and dirty to even see the brake line that runs across the support beam. TONS of mess. I'm guessing it's gonna be rough getting that drive shaft to stay in place when I re-assemble. After everything dried I was putting the pump in the oil pan to stash in my garage until I'm ready to install it and a bunch of grit or sand came out. Must have been stuck in the sludge in the screen. Turned the engine a bit and the cylinders look OK. (As if I'd know what they're supposed to look like) Wish there was a way to get the pistons out the bottom and put new rings in. Guess that'll happen in a few years when I pull the engine and rebuild it.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:04 PM.

Driving, racing or working on cars can be hazardous. The procedures and advice on this website including the message board are opinion only. Squarebirds.org and its webmasters and contributors do not guarantee the correctness of the advice and procedures. The Squarebirds.org and its webmasters assume no liability for any damage, fines, punishment, injury or death resulting from following these procedures or advice. If you do not have the skills or tools to repair your car, please consult a professional. By using this site you agree to hold harmless the Squarebirds.org, its authors and its webmasters from any resulting claim and costs that may occur from using the information found on this site.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Any submissions to this site and any post on this site becomes property of Squarebirds.org . The webmasters reserve the right to edit and modify any submissions to this site. All material on this is site is copyrighted by the Squarebirds.org. Reproduction by any means other than for personal use is strictly prohibited. Permission to use material on this site can be obtained by contacting the webmasters. Copyright 2002-2016 by Squarebirds.org.