1960 power steering problems - still

[tarps3]

Fellow birders,

It's been about 3 months of parts, cussing, and money and my power steering system still aerates fluid and blows it out the bolt hole in the top of the reservoir lid.
I've posted about this before, but I have a little more information now that might help.

I have rebuilt or replaced every single stinkin' piece of the power steering system with the exception of the medallion on the steering wheel. I have installed rebuilt or new ram cylinder, pump, hoses, control valve - you name it. We have tried 4 different pumps in addition to rebuilding and re-sealing the original.

When the wheels are turned one direction and then straightened, it spurts out fluid through the bolt hole in the reservoir lid. It simply pressurizes all the fluid out at highway speeds or driving any distance greater than 5 miles.
Nothing seems to be able to prevent this. Nothing.

A team of 3 mechanics have fought this all summer and it still pressurizes and I lose most of my fluid in a short time. Can't drive the S.O.B.!!!

ANY help or advice would be appreciated. Is there any other set-up from other years or model that will bolt in place of this piece of garbage?

Otherwise, does anyone have a manual steering set-up I can buy?

There's 20 bucks in it for someone who can give me advice that will fix it - really!

Casey
'60 hardtop (make me an offer)x(

[Alexander]

RE: 1960 power steering problems - still

In over twenty years of owning Squarebirds, the power steering systems in my cars have always been trouble free.

I can't imagine that the system would work correctly if the hoses are not connected to the proper connections.

When you say you had the ram and the control valve rebuilt, did they rebuild your units or did you send them in as exchange?

If you are nearby, I would take a look at your system.

Alexander
1959 Hardtop
1960 Golde Top

[tarps3]

RE: 1960 power steering problems - still

The Control valve was an exchange.
We rebuilt the ram cylinder and pump.
Then after many folks told me that the pump must be the problem, we exchanged it too (a couple of times).
My mechanics are just as stymied as you Alexander. They say in their 80+ years of cumulative experience they've never seen anything like it either.
What do you do when everything is new/fixed and it still doesn't work?

Can you drive these cars with the belt off? Will it tear up the mechanism or just make it hard to steer?

Casey

[Alexander]

RE: 1960 power steering problems - still

You will be able to drive the car with the belt off, but I do not think it will be good for the control valve long term.

When you say you rebuilt the ram, did you just replace the end seals or did you take apart the unit. I have replace the seals on my rams my self many times with no problem. If you took off the ram, I would check to see if the fittings ar not clogged. Check again with the shop manual that you connected the proper hoses in the proper way to the ram. If you do not have the diagram, I can post it.

Alexander
1959 Hardtop
1960 Golde Top

[tarps3]

RE: 1960 power steering problems - still

we just replaced the end seals of the ram.
In fact, that's the latest suspect. The mechanic thinks it may be faulty since it's really the only thing that hasn't actually been replaced.
I have a shop manual and I've double-checked all the hoses and connections.
Might have to get a re-built ram.
The mechanic thinks he might have someone locally who has one we could at least try.

If we could narrow it down to one thing that's causing it, then we would at least know what to do.

I live in Oklahoma where it is either 110 degrees or 20 degrees. Of course, for the past 3 weeks it's been sunny and 73 - perfect cruising weather if a guy had a car!
Thank goodness for my '64 Galaxie convertible. It hasn't had to share time since the Bird has been undrivable but man I'd sure like to drive my squarebird!

Casey
'60 hardtop

[1960Bird]

RE: 1960 power steering problems - still

It almost sounds as if some of the power steering fluid might be by passing the piston in the steering cyl. I have no experience with anything like this on my car so it is just a guess. With all you have done I can't think of anything else. Good luck!

Steve Ronk
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
1960 HT

[tarps3]

RE: 1960 power steering problems - still

I just talked to an older Ford mechanic this morning about this thing.
He said that the reservoir on my car was an older version and didn't have the horizontal deflector on the inside of the tank. He said it looked like the one in his 58 TBird shop manual. He went on to say that the top of the filter spring ought to have some sort of cupped washer or something that acts as the deflector on that particular reservoir. It keeps the fluid from being squirted ou the vent hole in the lid.

Does anyone have a '58 Bird they can look at for me and tell me what all is there at the spring between the bottom of the reservoir and the actual lid? The mechanic said there was a washer on top of the filter, then the spring, then the cupped deflector before the reservoir lid is installed.
If someone has the diagram from the '58 TBird shop manual, that would be appreciated too.

thanks!
Casey
'60 TBird

[Alexander]

RE: 1960 power steering problems - still

The resevoir in the 1958 to 1960 Thunderbirds had a filter in the resevior. The bottom of the resevior had a plate to put on the resevir. The lid had a spring retained plate that kept the fliter in place. Later resevoirs had a little metal deflector in the resevoir in front of the intake tube.

Alexander
1959 Hardtop
1960 Golde Top

[tarps3]

RE: 1960 power steering problems - still

that may be the problem.
my lid doesn't have a plate for the top of the spring.
The spring sits on a plate on top of the filter, then the lid just sits on the spring (there is no plate between the spring and the lid). This is what the fella was talking about I think. He said that plate on top of the spring kept the fluid from spraying up to the bottom side of the lid. I looked at his '58 shop manual and it showed exactly the type of reservoir I have - no deflector on the side of the tank. It didn't show the spring or plate so I am still not sure what it should look like.

Hopefully, someone out there with a '58 can tell me.

thanks,
Casey

[Alexander]

RE: 1960 power steering problems - still

All three years 1958-60 are the same as far as the resevoir.

Alexander
1959 Hardtop
1960 Golde Top

[tarps3]

RE: 1960 power steering problems - still

At the risk of "jinxing" myself, I am now willing to say that my power steering system is entirely functional. I got the car back Friday and won 1st place at a show on Saturday . . and my fluid didn't leak out all over the place. The frame and engine compartment are dry, dry!

We installed a new ram cylinder on Thursday (it was the last piece of a completely rebuilt system) and it seemed to pretty much do the trick. However, we also did one other thing that completely cured the problem. Get this:

The reservoir had been modified at some point in its life to accept an incorrect after-market filter. There was a spacer in the bottom of it to receive a different sized filter. Well, when we installed a correct filter during the re-build, it stuck up over the top of the fluid level. This served to intruduce a lot of air into the system and aerate the fluid out with a lot of air pressure.

Once we removed the spacer, the filter was completely immersed in the fluid - problem solved. Unbelievable. We researched the reservoir design at the local library Thursday night before we discovered this little glitch. "Hey, that part isn't supposed to be in there"!

I wish I had tried that first and maybe I wouldn't have had to rebuild the entire thing, but at least now, I'll never have to do it again!

thanks to everyone for their input! I'm back in business and on the road!!

Casey
'60 hardtop (yea, I like Squarebirds once again)

[Alexander]

RE: 1960 power steering problems - still

Glad that you found the problem. That one is certainly unusual.

Congratulations on the car show win.

Alexander
1959 Hardtop
1960 Golde Top

[BenCautious]

Power Steering Woes

My 58 is doing exactly what was originally described in this string. After driving any distance, a relatively hard turn will leave a puddle and dripping will continue when parked. On very short trips... nothing. Car is otherwise working pretty well... except that it was trashed during enclosed transport from SoCal to Houston. Ugh. I've never put a wrench on this car myself... what is it that I need? Where can I get the proper filter. Thanks!

[jopizz]

Where is the puddle located. Is it under the power steering pump (driver's side front of engine), power steering control valve (driver's side rear of engine) or power steering cylinder (passenger side rear of engine). All three are known to leak and may need new seals. It's probably not the pump as that usually leaks all the time. I would guess it's the control valve or cylinder. As for the filter I don't think it's available although I've seen a few on Ebay.

John

[BenCautious]

My Drippage

John --

This is going so seem really lame, but it was the return hose. 1/2" gash where it was hard to see, but leaking all over the place. It's just bulk hose. About a 10 minute fix. No more fluid.