Gen Light On Constantly

[jackbird60]

HI, JUST BOUGHT A NICE 60 BIRD, AND THE GEN LIGHT IS ON CONSTANTLY.

SO I THOUGHT IT NEEDED A NEW GENERATOR. I FIRST MADE SURE THAT THE FIELD WIRE MATCH THE FIELD WIRE RUNNING TO THE REGULATOR. IT DID.

SO I INSTALLED THE GENERATOR , POLARIZED THE GENERATOR, AND STARTED THE CAR, AND THE GEN LIGHT IS STILL CONSTANTLY ON.

THE ONE OTHER FACTOR THAT I THINK MIGHT BE CAUSING THIS IS THE IGNITION SWITCH. IT NEEDS TO BE REPLACE BECAUSE THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN START THE CAR AND TURN OFF THE CAR, IS BY PUSHING IN ON THE IGNITION AND THEN TURNING. SAME THING TO TURN OFF.

COULD THIS BE WHY THE IGNITION LIGHT IS ON BECAUSE IT THINKS IT'S IN THE ON POSITION INSTEAD OF THE START POSITION??

JACK

[tbird430]

You might try cleaning the regulator contacts (over on the left inner fender).

[simplyconnected]

If your GEN light is on, it indicates three things:
1. The ignition is on,
2. The bulb is good,
3. The generator is putting out less than the battery has stored.

The GEN light is important.

How it work:
The Gen light is fed from your ignition switch with +12,
current goes through the bulb and out the firewall to your regulator (bk/y wire) on the "A" terminal.
"A" is your armature. The wire going from your regulator to your armature is 'tickled' with that small amount of current from your GEN light to produce a small amount of magnetism inside the generator. So, the other end of your armature goes straight to ground through two brushes.

Your generator isn't putting out. THIS IS A TEST: If you want to check your generator (to see if it works), pull the "F" wire off your regulator, and touch it to "B" (battery) terminal. That will put full +12 on your field, allowing your armature to produce at full capacity. Put a meter across your battery and watch it go up. If you rev your engine a little, don't let the voltage go higher than 14-volts.

Why isn't the generator puttin out?
1. Bad generator
2. Regulator isn't turning the Field on (possibly POLARIZING may correct IF the regulator is good).
3. Bad grounds on either the regulator, generator, or both. Make SURE your battery NEG is bonded to your car's body. Electricity cannot punch twelve volts through rust.

[jackbird60]

Thanks ~~ The Regulator Looks Very Recent And Clean But I'll Look Again. I Know The Connection Are Tight And Very Clean. Still Thinking Ignition
But Not Sure.

Jack

[jackbird60]

Defientely Some Good Things To Check. Absolutely No Rust On The Car. Connections appear Good, I'll Recheck.

I Did Polarize Field To Batt. I'll Try Test.

Thanks

[JohnG]

Get a multimeter so you can see what the voltage at the battery is, with it running.

(as posted) clean the contacts. Had a new one once that did not function; cleaned the points with a business card and . . . voila!

A painted, clean car does not guarantee good grounds; often not as people painted places where there used to be bare metal. Sandpaper, small files and small wire brushes are key tools. Painters and body people care about how a car looks, not how it's electrical system works.

Personally, I keep a spare VR around just for situations like this. Quick change, fast info. Next place I go is to the brush holders in the generator. Crap can cause them to no longer move, resulting in poor contact and no generation.

John

[jackbird60]

Hi John,

Voltage runnning Is 12.6 . Not running 12.8.

I tried the Field Test where I took off the Field Wire at the Regulator and touched the Batt of the Regulator. It didn't do anything.

I took the Regulator cap off and that thing looks brand new. I checked again for contact for the wiring. As far as the Generator, that is a New/rebuilt Gen I just put in. Which is giving me the same results. Chances of 2 Gens being bad are slim I say, but who knows.

Jack

[JohnG]

the insides of the VR almost always look new, no matter how old or malfunctioning. It is a sealed unit living in a good location.

I would get another one.

Do you still have the other generator?

These days you can take them into some auto parts stores and have them bench tested.

A better option is to open the phone book and look in the Yellow Pages under "Auto Electric". Find a shop that does rebuilds. Take all the items you have (VR and generator(s) ) in and ask them to find out what's wrong. The older and grungier the place is, the better. They will tell you the truth and you go from there.

But for starters, I would get another VR from the local auto parts guys, ought to be possible in under 24 hours as it is a common item (nothing to do with Thunderbirds per se). As I said, having a spare around is good anyway, in the event #1 is still good. I like spares - they give me options and ways to eliminate things quickly.

[jackbird60]

Still No Luck. All Contacts Look Good. I Thought I Throw This Out There. Does It Mater If The Regulators Is 40 Amp But The Gen Is 30??

Also, Thinking Of The Alternator Solution. (maybe That Will Fix It)

Please Point Me To The Site. I Like To Know If I Can Use The Same Belt. If Not, What Kind Of Belt, (i Know Where To Buy The Bracket) And What Kind Of Alternator, And How Do I Wire It Up, And What Do I Do With Any Unused Wires.

Thanks,

Jack

[YellowRose]

Gen Light On Constantly

Hi Jack, If you want to go the Alternator route, check this out. I think most of the guys say that a 3-wire system is better than a 1 wire system. Here is a link with a lot of information in it including wiring schematics and Richard Hord's step by step procedure.

http://www.squarebirds.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=8831&highlight=generator

[jackbird60]

Hmmm! Not Sure On This! But The Connections Maybe Screwed Up. I Just Put Them Back Like They Where And Carefully Labeling Them Before Hand,


But,,, I Remember (it's After 10:00 Pm Now) The Black Wire With Red Stripe Connecting To The "A'" And

The Yellow & Black Wire Being Connected To The "ground" By The Way, This Is The Thicker Wire !

According To The Manual That's Backward.

Wonder If That Screw Up Anything. Anyway, Worth The Try.

Jack

[YellowRose]

Gen Light On Constantly

Jack, I looked at the '60 wiring schematic and here is what I see.

The heavy duty yellow-black wire comes off the A post on the generator and goes to the A post on the Voltage Regulator.
The smaller black-red wire comes off the G post on the generator and goes to the G post on the VR.
The smaller black-white wire comes off the F post on the generator and goes to the F post on the VR.
The smaller yellow-black wire comes off the VR A post and runs through the firewall to the Gen Light in your dash.

That is how I read that schematic, but someone who knows can verify that.

[simplyconnected]

Hmmm! Not Sure On This! But The Connections Maybe Screwed Up. I Just Put Them Back Like They Where And Carefully Labeling Them Before Hand,


But,,, I Remember (it's After 10:00 Pm Now) The Black Wire With Red Stripe Connecting To The "A'" And

The Yellow & Black Wire Being Connected To The "ground" By The Way, This Is The Thicker Wire !

According To The Manual That's Backward.

Wonder If That Screw Up Anything. Anyway, Worth The Try.

Jack

Jack, before you start ANY troubleshooting, you must be certain the wires are correct. On these old T-birds the wires are exposed and very easy to trace. If you're still in doubt, pull the ends free and check them with an ohm meter.
If you have the blk/y wire going to ground, you are feeding +12 directly to ground. (NOT good.)

I tried the Field Test where I took off the Field Wire at the Regulator and touched the Batt of the Regulator. It didn't do anything.... Chances of 2 Gens being bad are slim I say,..

If they're BOTH connected wrong, you will get the same results.

...Does It Mater If The Regulators Is 40 Amp But The Gen Is 30??
Also, Thinking Of The Alternator Solution. (maybe That Will Fix It)

An oversized voltage regulator will work the same.

Don't put good money after bad, save your fifty bucks for the regulator. Visit your local bone yard and get a 130-amp Ford alternator with an internal regulator (they all have them, now). The whole thing should cost around fifty bucks.

CLICK HERE

The wiring diagram is the very last picture. Notice, all the power wires get spiced together except for the little bk/y wire going to your GEN light. - Dave

[JohnG]

So at this point, for all we know, the VR and generator you have might work fine. No way to know until you get the wiring back to where it is supposed to be. That sounds worth pursuing!

John

[jackbird60]

Well On This 60 Bird The Wires On The Gen Are:

Solid Yellow: Thick Wire

Black With Red Stripe:

Black With White Stripe:


On The Vr:

Bat: 2 Solid Yellow Wires
Fld: Black With White Stripe
Arm: Thk Yellow, Thin Yellow, & Condensor Wire.
Grd : Black With Red Stripe

So It Appears That The Grd Is The Blk With Red Stripe According To The Vr.

I Have To Chg The Wire Connector "strblk With Red stripe" In Order To Fit Over Pole In The Back Of The Gen.

Here Goes Nothing.

Jack