lower control arm shims

[Eric S]

I did this a couple of years ago. If I can do it, you can do it, probably but ... FOLLOW THE MANUAL. I did that and it was easy (I mean when I found out the new bushings I installed were wrong which took me weeks to realise...)

[dczerwonski]

Hey guys,
I'm currently installing the front end with all new bushings and have the opposite problem. When lower control arm bushings are fully pressed in there is not enough space to install the arm. I had to push the bushings back few millimeters. The arms went in tightly, no front/back movement. The arm rotates with some minimal resistance. No shims of course. That doesn't feel right. What bothers me most is that pushing the bushings back wasn't exactly a precise science Is this acceptable or what's the next move here?

[simplyconnected]

I trust you already read the earlier posts because suspension work is DANGEROUS.

From the factory, location of the shims is NON-negotiable. ALL lower 'A' arms are butted against the #2 crossmember (which also holds engine mounts) and any excess bushing space is shimmed in the #1 crossmember, which is the front or first crossmember.

The number of shims or the thickness of shims may vary. There are NO two car bodys that are identical because they are made of sheet metal and welded together. The welding process makes metal move as well, so we use welding fixtures for better consistency. Nothing here is perfect, so we use shims to make it perfect....

ALL stamped sheet metal is dimensionally different because thickness can change on the same coil, steel alloy and spring-back can be quite different too. All pivot motion happens in the urethane. The busing bolts are there to hold the bushing's inner shell from moving which is why they have teeth. Even after you tighten the bushings, the arms are designed to move within the bushing.

Some shims can hide in road dirt and grease but they come out when scraped. Shove that lower arm all the way back and add shims to take up any space left in the front. If the fit is tight, that is good. Your alignment is mainly done with shims in the upper arms.

Follow your Shop Manual and put the bushings in correctly. - Dave

[dczerwonski]

Thanks for quick reply!

I trust you already read the earlier posts because suspension work is DANGEROUS.

No worry, I've already seen a coil damaging a ceiling (and don't want to see it again ) and I'm familiar with the hazards. I have the shop manual, following it, but it doesn't solve my issue (it just says to install shims as needed to remove the movement)

I have the shims, they were there before, everything was cleaned to bare metal. But with new bushings fully pressed in the arm just don't fit. It's too long, waaay to long. So I've pushed back the bushings and the arm fits tight now (and I mean tight - I had to punch it with rubber hammer to get it into place, there is zero forward movement).

My question is - is this ok that I dont need any shims and that the bushings are not pressed in fully to the flange or is there something really wrong?

[jopizz]

Refer to the following post and picture.

https://www.squarebirds.org/vbulletin/forum/-1958-to-1960-thunderbirds-general-technical-discussion/-1958-to-1960-squarebirds-general-technical-discussion/22066-lower-control-arm-shims?p=168395#post168395

John

[simplyconnected]

Here is a lower control arm bushing:
image.png

Notice two things; the serrations on the ends AND the protrusions on the bottom just befoe the flange. Those protrusions are STOPS. If you push the bushing all the way to the flange, that is too far.

The upper bushings are the same story:
image.png
- Dave

[dczerwonski]

I see it now. Looks like my lower bushings don't have these. I got DORMAN bc850535pr. Rockauto lists them as lower bushings for 1960 bird.



Now I see they are a bit wider near the flange, didn't notice that earlier. didn't even feel it when pressing in.

Anyway, what's your advice here? Shall I get new bushings, push current ones back a bit more or just leave it how it is?

[simplyconnected]

Rock Auto's prices are WAYYYYYYY too high- and they are the wrong parts. These bushings should cost around TEN BUCKS each:

Eckler's 54-62 Ford&Merc. Lower ControlArm Bushing | Ford | Thunderbird | Galaxie Fairlane Continental Ranchero Full Size Mercury Ford All (macsautoparts.com) In Lockport, NY. Under ten bucks each

Tee-Bird Products in PA - 2012catalog (amazonaws.com) $10 each

Dennis-Carpenter: Control Arm BushingLower - Inner for 1954-59 Ford Cars | Dennis Carpenter Ford Restorations (dennis-carpenter.com) Under $8/each.

I'm sure there are many more T-bird vendors that are similar in cost. - Dave

[dczerwonski]

That seems to be true. I've been ordering parts for my Chevy C3 from rockauto many times and everything was always good. So it's always my first choice. For the Bird - it's not the first time I got the wrong part. The problem is that rockauto is the only big parts store I know that offers fast, problem free and reasonably priced shipping to Poland. Others ship mostly with USPS (which means 1-2 months of waiting and possibility of not getting it at all - polish post is a definition of disastrous service ) or dont ship to Europe at all.

Anyway, big thanks for the help, I would never notice it.

Meanwhile I'll just leave it how it is as I need to get it back on the wheels and get correct ones later on when making a bigger order from one of the specialized Bird stores.

Thanks again!
David

[simplyconnected]

Many of our vendors ship overseas and ALL of them specialize in Ford parts.
I like Rock Auto for certain things but they only list parts that their suppliers okay. I ran into this when I found parts that are available for full-size Ford cars but not Galaxie. I spoke with the owner, explaining that the Galaxie IS a Fairlane but with a different trim package. I said, all the suspension parts are shared with both models. He wouldn't budge. His position was, he only offers returns on parts that are listed for those particular models supported by his supplier. In other words, he depends on his suppliers for all technical information.

We also ran into lower ball joints that don't fit. Always reference our Technical Resource Library AND our list of vendors. Many times, our vendors' prices beat the larger stores. Send emails to vendors and find out if they ship overseas. - Dave

[Eric S]

Dawid
I had the same problem on the bushings. Ordered them from Bird Nest. They fit fine but also all the way to the flange. Dave explained, just above, that it was supposed to stop on the "stops" but mine didn't at all and was sliding right to the flange. I was at a loss. It tooks me several weeks to try to understand until I ordered another set from another of our supplier and it fits right away and I had space for shims. Bird Nest offered a refund so I assumed they learned from the problem on their batch.
The new bushings were finished differently so they obviously did not came from the same factory.

[simplyconnected]

I have been thinking about this issue. Millions of Ford cars and trucks used these same bushings including Edsel and Lincoln. For the life of me I cannot figure out why anyone would change their dies (unless the new bushings are cheap Chinese knockoffs made in washed-out Kirksite dies).

Now that we are faced with the problem, I don't want to but I'm thinking we could use a simple spacer or a tack weld to make sure the bushing doesn't enter the control arm too far. As far as the function of the new bushings, I don't see a problem.

I think I have a spare set of bushings that I will measure tomorrow. - Dave

[Eric S]

For me new bushings are definitively made in asia somewhere...

[dczerwonski]

Some thick spacer would be an elegant solution imho

[simplyconnected]

Yes, and it could be cut from a steel tube or pipe.