Noisy A/c Belt?

[Tbird1044]

I've been fighting a noisy/squealing AC belt for a while now. I replaced the belt twice. One cheap and the last one was a Gates belt. The AC system is not charged so there really isn't any load on the belt. I know it is belt noise, because as soon as I spray a little belt dressing on it, the noise goes away, but it only lasts for a short period. I have shimmed out the AC compressor bracket to better align the pulleys. I even made a bracket that fits between the compressor and support bracket so I can better tension and align the pulleys. It has gotten better, and is now quiet at idle, but will start to make noise at higher RPMs. When I first start the car, it is quiet for about 10 min. and then as the car warms up, it gets noisy again. I am looking to replace the pulley on the water pump as there is a small notch out of the V groove. Looks like somebody tried to pry it.
Anybody got a spare 3 sheave pulley for a 352?

[simplyconnected]

Gates belts are of good quality. Can you show us pictures of your setup?

We had one here, a few months back, where they used two belts on the crank and water pump pulley but the sheaves were different diameters! Then, they wondered why they smelled burning rubber. - Dave

[YellowRose]

Noisy A/c Belt?

Nyles sent me some pix to post for him and also some additional comments. Here is what he had to say.

"I've been having a problem with my AC belt squealing and posted on the forum for help and someone wanted some pictures. Could you please post them?

I also made a thin plate to fit under the AC compressor to tension it and also help in the alignment. It was pretty simple and work great. Think they wanted to see that also.

I have aligned the pulleys and tightened the belt and it still squeals when it gets hot. I know it is the AC belt since I ran the car without that belt and there was no noise. I cleaned all the shives, replaced the belt twice and the noise is still there. I'm now looking for a water pump pulley with 3 V grooves. With my stethoscope, I can tell the noise is coming from this pulley. Hmmmm?"

[simplyconnected]

Yep! Look at the first two pics. Your two pulleys are different diameters from the middle sheave to the one closest to the fan.

If you must run two belts around the crank AND the water pump, those pulleys must be the same diameter.

Solution: Take that A/C belt off of the crank. Simply run it from the water pump to the A/C compressor. - Dave

[Tbird1044]

Is that how Ford originally drove the AC compressor? With a single belt running off the water pump pulley only? That might be the reason that whenever I look up a belt, it always turns out to be way to short. Any of you guys out there with a 60 Bird with AC, could you tell me what size of belt is on your car for the AC? Now I'm really confused.

[YellowRose]

Noisy A/c Belt?

My belt from my AC unit on my '59 is a Premium XL 25-7530. I think the 25 means it is a 25" belt. I took some pix of the routing of it for you. I would imagine that the '60 would be the same way. I also have some pix of other peoples '60 Tbirds set up. First my 4 pix.

[Tbird1044]

Thank you for the pics. I am still confused. The second pic you posted shows the AC belt going to the crank/water pump/compressor. That is what I have been trying to do. When I looked at the tech. library on how to install AC on a 60 Bird, it shows the factory belt only went from the Water pump pulley to the AC comp. I find it odd that the crank pulley has the third V groove for the AC compressor. All of the belts listed from the auto parts stores were really short and I kept returning them to get my original belt size (could have been changed and not factory) which would explain why the belt would only go from the water pump pulley to the AC compressor and not be connected to the crank pulley. This is really strange, but not the only oddity of the 60 Bird.

[simplyconnected]

Sorry you feel confused but if you use a tape measure and go around the top (WP) pulley and your a/c pulley, you will have your measurement. Depending on the present position of your adjustment slide, add or subtract an inch.

If you get the wrong size, auto parts stores will exchange them at no charge. - Dave

[Tbird1044]

I planned on doing that and then checking that dimension against the belt that the auto parts store list for the car. I just never realized that Ford was not using the crank pulley and only using the water pump pulley to drive the AC unit. Hopefully this will resolve my problem. Thanks for heading me in the right direction.

[jopizz]

The extra groove on the crank pulley is for a dual belt generator used on AC cars I believe. At least it was on the '62 Bird I had.

John

[simplyconnected]

Nyles, as said, you aren't the first to run into this problem. Back in Nov of 2011 there was a good post regarding water pump pulleys.

Ray's pulleys are different from yours. I can plainly see your water pump pulley is cast iron and it has a larger diameter than the one next to it.

PLEASE CLICK HERE

I holp this helps. - Dave

[Tbird1044]

Dave:
Thanks. More good info. Never would I have thought that belt pulleys could be this confusing. When I look at my 1960 shop manual, on page 12-35 there is a picture of the AC belt going around the crank/water pump/AC comp. Pulleys. Like my set up now. Then I looked in the tech. Library, and there are Factory instructions on how to install AC in your Squarebird. One of the PDF's show the belt only running from the water pump pulley to the AC compressor pulley. I don't have a problem of running the belt on a 2 pulley system if guys have this working out there. This week, I am going to check the dimension for a 2 pulley setup and compare that against the belt size that all the auto parts are showing.

Thank you all for your input.

[YellowRose]

Noisy A/c Belt?

Can any of you '60 Tbird owners with A/C take some pix of the way your A/C belt is run? Apparently, my '59 belt from from my A/C compressor is different than the '60. If you could take some pix like I did of mine, perhaps that will help Nyles figure out how his should be run and end the confusion. Also it would be helpful to let him know which length of belt he should have on it. Thanks.

[KULTULZ]

When I look at my 1960 shop manual, on page 12-35 there is a picture of the AC belt going around the crank/water pump/AC comp. Pulleys. Like my set up now.

Then I looked in the tech. Library, and there are Factory instructions on how to install AC in your Squarebird. One of the PDF's show the belt only running from the water pump pulley to the AC compressor pulley.

Factory install air will be (most likely will be) much different in detail(s) from either dealer install (factory kit) or aftermarket.
____________________________________________________________ _________________

Also, is it possible from someone to post this page (12-35) mentioned from the 1960 BIRD Shop Manual?

The drive belt chart in the MPC (Basic PN 8620) does show dual GEN drive belts with factory AC. What is confusing is that there are four drive belts (2 GEN [3/8"] - 1 PS [1/2"] - 1 AC [1/2"]) listed but only three drive sheaves on the WP and CS pulleys (one being on the actual balancer and the other two on an outer CS pulley.

I am wondering if correct factory asm (OEM AC) uses the same drive belt for both PS and AC ( 1/2")? The MPC does not have the actual FEAD ILL install but was most likely removed (may have been) during an update change in it's history.

There has to be either an untouched original install or dedicated restoration example somewhere to view.

Does anyone have an assembly manual?

[jopizz]

Also, is it possible from someone to post this page (12-35) mentioned from the 1960 BIRD Shop Manual?

This is the diagram that he's referring to. However most of the parts books show the compressor belt as 44 inches. This setup looks like it would need a much longer belt than that.