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  #31  
Old 01-05-2016, 04:56 PM
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Two questions...
  1. Why 8 quarts in an FE engine? I can see maybe one extra quart if your engine is sustaining high speeds (Interstate highway driving) because a lot of oil will be on top of both heads if your rocker arms are not restricted.
  2. Why break-in an engine with such high viscosity oil? Are you looking for higher concentrations of ZDDP for flat tappets?

A combination of too much heavy oil will tax your engine to overcome the sheer resistance and as a result, drastically reduce gas mileage and HP.

Modern Ford engines run hotter and they use 5W20 blended oil. So, heavier viscosity doesn't equal better lubrication. Why such drastic departures from the owner's manual? - Dave
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  #32  
Old 01-05-2016, 07:13 PM
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Back when I first approached Kevin about building this motor, the first thing he asked me after what I wanted from it was whether it had been rebuilt before. He didn't want to touch a rebuilt motor because he's had too many problems fixing other's mistakes. I assured him it was a 50 year old engine that had never been opened up.

My goal is for it to run with a little more power and torque than the factory gave it, which meant a mild "street" cam, with the stock transmission and torque converter, very dependable and run 250,000 miles. I had read Rabotnik's book on performance FE engines, and told Kevin that I was always concerned about low oil pressure for this motor, and Rabotnik had a solution for that, and I gave him the pages of the book where this was outlined. Kevin read it and agreed that this was generally a good approach, so we ordered a high volume oil pump, he chose a restrictor size and made the modifications, including streamlining the oil passages.

Kevin didn't like Rabotnik's recommendation to use the stock pan and add a 6th quart of oil, and recommended a 7 quart pan with a matched pickup. There was no 7 quart available when I ordered the part, so bought the Moroso 8 qt.

Kevin included in this build his "recipe" proven to be successful to him, and he builds a lot of motors from lightly modified like mine to full race stuff. This includes generous bearing clearances and Joe Gibbs 15W-50 oil for the life of the build, not just break in.
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  #33  
Old 01-05-2016, 08:08 PM
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Here's what the big end looks like with the gasket partially scraped off and before I remove the oil pump.

1. Front
2. Screen and behind #1
2a. Screen blow-up. That's more gasket material.
3. Behind #2. Note how clean everything is (except for the screen)
3a. Close up, showing that Kevin numbered all the connecting rods before he sent them off to Clemmons Speed shop for balancing.
4. This is all I found at the bottom of the pan. On the left is grey RTV, obviously mine. On the right is a thin shard of rubber like material. It stretches like RTV, but I used all grey. It's the only one I found so far.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1.JPG (102.3 KB, 61 views)
File Type: jpg 2.JPG (101.9 KB, 61 views)
File Type: jpg 2a.JPG (142.3 KB, 62 views)
File Type: jpg 3.JPG (98.5 KB, 65 views)
File Type: jpg 3a.JPG (107.3 KB, 61 views)
File Type: jpg 4.JPG (101.4 KB, 62 views)

Last edited by Yadkin : 01-05-2016 at 09:02 PM.
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  #34  
Old 01-05-2016, 08:59 PM
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Here's the oil pump.

5. Rotor and star (not sure what it's called)
6. Housing
7. Cover
8. Star
9. These were on the screen. More grey RTV and some small pieces of paper gasket.

Bottom line, no metal in the entire assembly, just some gasket material from my previous assembly, which I should have been more careful and clean.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 5.JPG (91.6 KB, 67 views)
File Type: jpg 6.JPG (94.9 KB, 68 views)
File Type: jpg 7.JPG (103.3 KB, 67 views)
File Type: jpg 8.JPG (103.4 KB, 70 views)
File Type: jpg 9.JPG (88.8 KB, 68 views)
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  #35  
Old 01-05-2016, 09:15 PM
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Don't beat yourself up over it. At least you know what is in your engine; something you can deal with. If these pieces got past your oil filter there is a good chance they will plug small oil holes, and there are many.
Each rocker arm has two (to lube the tip and pushrod), each connecting rod has one (to squirt oil from the rod bearing to the bottom of the piston) and each lifter has one (to pump up the plunger).

At this stage in the game I would pull bearing caps, remove the crank & cam and use water pressure to wash out the galleries and rocker shafts. THEN, install those $700 lifters. - Dave
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  #36  
Old 01-06-2016, 12:04 AM
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I'm not pulling the motor and undoing all Kevin's work. The pictures prove that he did a great job, took a lot of care and pride assembling this engine, even paint-indicated all the bolts as he torqued them. Far better than I could do in my garage that doubles as a wood shop, garden tool storage, and a hospice space for my dying cat. Kevin's got a clean room with stainless steel wash sinks and plenty of clean bench space.

There are no indications that any pieces of sealer got past the filter. All that I found was either in the filter, a few on the screen and two or three on the bottom of the oil pan.

If this crap was clogging up tiny oiling holes, soft bearing material would wear very quickly and there would be indications of that on the bottom of the pan. I know what that looks like because I've seen it before on an engine that went without oil. I'd also expect to see a lot more iron than I found on the magnet, which was basically the amount of an exposed lead on a pencil, easily attributed to break-in.

I'd also expect to see stuff not getting lubricated on the valve train when I prime with my open top valve covers. Instead I see consistent oiling at all 16 rockers.

These lifters were ruined by the Joker that I hired to help me last time. He's since been fired by the way, not for this but for other crap that he's screwed up. And he's no longer working as a mechanic.
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  #37  
Old 01-07-2016, 12:11 AM
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I got the pan back on, the engine set back down in its mounts, assembled the top end and adjusted the valves. I can see where Joker went wrong, there tends to be a bit of "stiction" on new lifters, in a box for weeks or months or longer, and when the adjusters are turned all the way out it's tricky to see when the valves are operating. No need to prime while doing this, which was Kevin's recommendation.

Three ways to make a mistake. I found all three, apparently. Let the phone ring, ignore the outside world, focus, pay attention to what's happening and if you can't internally explain it, figure out why.

Find zero lash carefully, look for the lifter compressing with 1/2 turn, not the valve. Any questions turn all the way down to work the preload spring and be patient to wait for the plunger to return. These Lunati's have a long preload travel (3 turns or 0.15", twice what the Cranes had. The manufacturer specifies a light preload, per my calculations 3/8 to 1/2 turn.

Then double check with the preload springs compressed, making sure you didn't screw up the first time.

Finally, torque the lock nuts to the adjuster manufacturer's settings instead of using "mechanics feel".

After I got everything set, valve covers on, poured in 8 qt's of new oil and primed it. Then I found 10 degrees BTDC on the #1 cylinder and dropped the distributor in. Incredibly it dropped all the way in- first time that ever happened for me, I must be livin' right.

I have to get back to my real job tomorrow, a long trip to Fayetteville. That will give the black RTV plenty of time to set if by chance I get back to it on Friday. More than likely will be next Tuesday or Wednesday.
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  #38  
Old 01-07-2016, 07:12 AM
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Fingers crossed for you! Can't wait to hear the outcome....
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  #39  
Old 01-07-2016, 10:22 PM
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Thanks. Mine crossed as well.

I got home at a reasonable time so spent an hour or two installing the spark plug wires, fixed one that was broken, installed a connector on the distributor module wires, primed the pump, put my tools away and swept the garage. I didn't want to start it up tonight because my neighbor works early shift and needs his sleep.
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  #40  
Old 01-08-2016, 07:20 PM
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Great day! Started her up, nice and quiet valve train, oil pressure at cold about 2/3 of the gauge, which I interpret as 80 psi. Warm it up, the electric fan and control keeps the coolant art around 185 +/-5 degrees F. Oil pressure drops to about 1/2 of cold. I set a new tune and adjusted the throttle plates and went for a 10 mile drive to burn off the oil spilled on the exhaust ports and headers.

Came home, had lunch, drove to Mocksville, took I40 two exits and experienced a lot of vibration above 70 mph. This seems to be from the driveshaft but I had that balanced. Good acceleration though, from 55 to 75 takes no time at all. I got off on the local two-lane and the car runs much better at 55 to 60. Oil pressure high, like at cold idle.

Very docile around town, good idle quality. I picked up my mail then went to the bank drive-through, kept the engine idling the whole time and no problem talking with the teller. She's got a '57 Chevy at home!

Drove it back into the garage and parked it. No stink! All I can smell is a fresh coat of paint curing on the intake manifold.

Last edited by Yadkin : 01-08-2016 at 07:31 PM.
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