Eric's 1960 T-Bird

[Eric S]

On upper arms
The ORIGINAL bushings seems well to have been ran into the arm PAST the shoulder if I judge from the steel having been shaved.
So again, are they supposed to be stopped at the shoulder or passed in?
I see on Larry's TBird that the upper arm bushing beside being 50% cheaper than at Bird Nest, do not have the shoulder ???


Now I seem to be too weak to hammer them in any more and the flanges are crushing.

The only way that seems to be left is to use Ford's special tools per the manual. WIt hopes that I can enter them without crushing the flange.
Tools are not really sophisticated, maybe some tubes and rods. So I guess it would be easier to work that the Ford's way.
If anybody has some drawings of the Ford's tools I will be glad to get them !
Or anybody used commercial tools?

I really can not see how Dave can hammer them in so easily. Is there any chance parts has been modified ?

Now this lead to another question.
As I learned it the bad way, the inner sleeve can be tear off.
So how tight do we want the bushings on the inner shafts.
Too loose an d the screws will press on the urethane to make contact on the shafts and make an useless tension.
Too much pressure on the bushing and the inner sleeve will touch the shaft and puyshed back and tear off.

[Woobie]

At this point I would recommend renting the proper tools to install the bushings. If the auto parts stores in your area offer the specific tools needed as a free loan; that would be better yet.

If you have the proper bushings this should be about an hour or so to do both sides, upper and lower with coffee break.

The struggle that you are experiencing tells me that something is wrong with the new parts or control arms and some damage may be happening. Not good.

[Derbird]

Dave must be a very persistent and big guy. I too started hammering them in and quickly decided to put them in a press.

[Eric S]

I don't know where to rent tools in my area so I'd be better making them or getting a commercial set.
It will be always usefull to get it should I need it later.
Derbird, did yurs had the shoulder too? Did you passed the shoulder?

[OX1]

I don't know where to rent tools in my area so I'd be better making them or getting a commercial set.
It will be always usefull to get it should I need it later.
Derbird, did yurs had the shoulder too? Did you passed the shoulder?

Here is the tool I used. Super easy.......







Says $37 international shipping to france

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Upper-Control-Arm-Puller-Set-New-OEMTOOLS-27206/192541493418?epid=1839959108&hash=item2cd45e08aa:g:cpEAAOSwkChaqJeJ:rk:1:pf:0

[YellowRose]

Eric's 1960 T-Bird

When suggesting that someone run down to the local Harbor Freight, Home Depot, Lowes, or local tool parts store, it is good to look over on the right side of the post to see where that person is located at... In Eric's case, he is, as someone just pointed out, in France, where stores like that may not be located...

[Woobie]

Very good point and highly unusual to have squarebird control arms in france

[Eric S]

Thank you guys
Ordering via UPS or any other courrier makes France and the US (or any other part of the world) looks pretty close.

However I still do not know if I need to pass the shoulder into the arm???
Again the bushings at HarrysTbird has no shoulder. Those at Bird Nest do have one and I am afraid (based on the hammer strikes I did) that I can not pass the shoulder with this simple OEMTools...

Also anyone installed the lower arms with no shims?

[OX1]

Thank you guys
Ordering via UPS or any other courrier makes France and the US (or any other part of the world) looks pretty close.

However I still do not know if I need to pass the shoulder into the arm???
Again the bushings at HarrysTbird has no shoulder. Those at Bird Nest do have one and I am afraid (based on the hammer strikes I did) that I can not pass the shoulder with this simple OEMTools...

Also anyone installed the lower arms with no shims?

The inner edge of bushing metal tube has teeth that have to bite into shaft, on both sides.



Both bushings also have to be in an equal amount in
control arm, to center bar. Not sure how you know how
much to insert the first bushing, without the shoulder.
Is there a dimension in shop manual maybe?

Anyway, bunch of pics I took here when doing mine.

http://luxjo.supermotors.net/59%20T-BIRD/SUSPENSION/UPPER%20CONTROL%20ARMS/

and yes, I only put shims on one side of my lowers, that is all that would fit. I believe it was the rear, as theoretically, it gives you a smidgen more caster.

[Woobie]

I don't know where to rent tools in my area so I'd be better making them or getting a commercial set.
It will be always usefull to get it should I need it later.

There are areas around here that are 40 miles from the nearest post office so I understand what you are referring to.

The kit that OX1 referenced in the previous message is one that I have used many times and is of high quality. It was a free rental from the parts store that may have been used a hundred times before.

[simplyconnected]

Henry, you have great pictures. Can I use them for reference?

I keep my ****nal of tools simple for reasons that;

• they are expensive
• I don't need specialty tools much
• I don't want to store a bunch of tools I don't need or seldom use.
• I have what I need but I can also make pullers, etc.

I'm serious when I said I use hammers and pipe nipples, NOT my 20-ton press. I can't get a feel for my work in the press but I can using hand tools. Others may use other methods.

I recommended you take before and after pictures because they tell the whole story.

Randy Harsha took pictures of his Squarebird parts car's control arms before changing his bushings. This is Randy's FIRST TIME for changing bushings. He chose to use a hacksaw to remove the urethane and inner sleeve. The remaining outer shells are still in the lower arm holes, plainly showing the 'hash stops'.

These are unmolested Ford bushings showing exactly how deep they were installed at the factory. NONE of them are driven all the way as these pictures show air gaps between all the flanges and the control arms. I also included Eric's picture of the outer upper arm shells that he removed. They show witness marks from where they stopped. BTW, Randy didn't use specialty tools either because they simply aren't necessary (but hey, it's your money to do with what you want). I've never seen an aftermarket Ford bushing without a shoulder.

I start the following pictures with a lower arm then the upper arm. I did not include Randy's 'after' pictures but his finished arms look beautiful:

[Woobie]

Those are great photos.

Maybe it's time to put the micrometer to work taking measurements to insure the correct parts are being installed.

I'd hate to sit here and hear that you have destroyed your control arms through all this.

[Eric S]

Dave
what do you mean here :
The shims are inserted BEFORE the spring goes in.

I am not sure if the bushing at Larry's TBird had a shoulder or not as the picture is the same on another Bushing with a different part number. Maybe their picture is just the wrong one... I asked them.

On my original upper bushings, as I said they look like the "shouldered" upper bushings has been passed the shoulder.
You said Witness mark at the shoulder stop. But I think the shoulder stop has been moved (see picture below) as I can see 2 witeness marks.

Henry
thank you for the pictures. I can see on 1 upper arm, the bushing flange is almost touching.
So that means that I need to PASS the shoulder.
I remain concerned that the tools you used has not enough force to press them in though with a mere "screw".
And after 2 heavy hammer strokes on the right hand the other day and 1 grinder disk cut in a left hand finger and 5 hours in the hospital today to "close the gap" on another job I need to use clever tools and no BULL force.
Maybe I should pay somebody to do the work

Anyway on uppers,
I need to remove the bushing that I destroyed and I don't think the tool can push the other way. As the part are painted I don't want to burn the urethane so I will make a tool per the manual. I should be able to use some tubes and squares to do it.

Woobie
It is unfortunately too late to make measures and the punched holes do not afford exact references to make measures. Also I am not sure that originalk and replacements are same size anbd originals lost some integrity, having been melt down, burnt anbd inner and outer sleeve being separated.
I seem to never make enough pictures or enough measurments when disassembling. Learning the bad way.

On lowers
as I said I can not make accurate measurements. And I really don't have a problem with them except I am not using shims to compensate for fore and aft movement which is not present.
Shims only fit on the front of the arm so the rear has contact inner sleeve/crossmember. With no shims. So the absence of shims do not seems to be a problem as such and again I have no room for shims except if I take back more the bushings but will then loose grip (they are already not seated in full).

And just in case you may ask, yes I triple checked that I used the upper busqhings on upper arms and lower bushings on lower arms.

So to ummarize the "only" problems I have are
1. Is no shim OK on the lowers. If OK then I don't have any problem and I don't see how it could be different.
2. Beside the fact that I need new ones, I just need to install new upper bushings and PASS this **** shoulder so I have a nice contact on the inner shaft.

I agree that's a lot of messages for nothing really difficult but this shoulder is really tough to pass over...

[OX1]

Those 2 lines are just the shoulder and where the control arm was wrapped around the outer bushing tube, on the inside.

Neither the bushings I pulled out, nor the one's I put back, had a shoulder that started out that far inboard, as you are suggesting.

I'm pretty sure these were original.

http://luxjo.supermotors.net/59%20T-BIRD/SUSPENSION/UPPER%20CONTROL%20ARMS/20160911_110754.jpg

That is distance you are looking for. There is no way a person could "extrude" that shoulder, that perfectly, if it started at the inboard line (especially using another piece of thick
sheet metal that was doing the extruding, IE control arm).


And the pic I think you are talking about, it is an optical illusion.

http://luxjo.supermotors.net/59%20T-BIRD/SUSPENSION/UPPER%20CONTROL%20ARMS/20160911_110305.jpg

It's not pressed in all the way flat like you think (at least I think that is what you are saying). Just look at the distance from the other end here

http://luxjo.supermotors.net/59%20T-BIRD/SUSPENSION/UPPER%20CONTROL%20ARMS/20160911_110254.jpg

You can see it's about the same as the one's with white overspray (hard to see, but you can glimpse inner part of
bushing tube).

http://luxjo.supermotors.net/59%20T-BIRD/SUSPENSION/UPPER%20CONTROL%20ARMS/20170121_084439.jpg

And yes, that tool I posted has different cups for pressing in or out.

Did you ever post pics of exactly what you currently have going on?

[Eric S]

The only handy picture I have is there (made it larger this time)
Not having to pass this shoulder (which is what I am asking for days) would explain why I can not do it.
But then how can I squeeze the inner shaft as it is still loose by .40".
I made nothing that would have widenned the arm by that much...

The 2 pictures that made me think they were all the way in are

http://luxjo.supermotors.net/59%20T-BIRD/SUSPENSION/UPPER%20CONTROL%20ARMS/20160817_201020.jpg

http://luxjo.supermotors.net/59%20T-BIRD/SUSPENSION/UPPER%20CONTROL%20ARMS/20160911_110305.jpg