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  • YellowRose
    Super-Experienced


    • Jan 21 2008
    • 17188

    Disk Brake Conversion Discussion

    Hi Anders,

    That is a tar like sealer that was used to stop any leakage of air from out around the plenum. Dave or Richard or one of the guys can probably give you the correct name for it. It escapes me at the moment. I think it is the same stuff that they used in the Wixom plant to seal things with.

    Ray Clark - Squarebirds Administrator
    The Terminator..... VTCI #11178 ITC #6000 Yellow Mustang Registry (YMR) #12188
    Contact me via Private Message for my email address, or Call (Cell) 210-875-1411

    https://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm
    Faye's Ovarian Cancer Memorial Website.
    https://faye.rayclark.info/index.html

    Comment

    • simplyconnected
      Administrator
      • May 26 2009
      • 8778

      Anders, I don't have a technical term for it, but all our local (home) A/C contractors use it. I believe it comes in rolls. It was definately applied after the car went through the factory Sealer Deck and Paint, because it cannot withstand 250 degrees F (the paint ovens). It's not painted, either. All the other factory sealer 'cures' in the paint ovens. I think your soft sticky stuff is designed to seal cold water and air without cracking over time.

      Originally posted by Howard Prout
      ...I had visions of trying to plumb a cross over system and was having difficulty understanding how this would be done.
      A despirate word of caution: Do not cross your brake system. Ford did that in the old days and cars just spun in circles. You can imagine, going around a bend and hitting your brakes, one front and the opposite rear. Bad news. It is far safer to divide your brakes by, Front pair and Rear pair.

      Here's a rule-of-thumb, on ANY master cylinder, the larger reservoir end goes to the front disk brakes. Some Ford M/C's have a larger reservoir in the back (like John's). That still goes to the front disk brakes (he did it right). GM's large side is in the front (like mine).

      Don't be afraid to drill a couple holes for your brake devices. They will NEVER move, once installed. Make it a nice, neat job (rather than looking for existing holes that aren't used. Put your proportioning valve, tees, etc., where they should be. If they should have an angle bracket, make one. If you need to get to an adjustment knob, put it in a place accessible to you. Then plumb. The sign of a good plumbing job is, how well everything is fastened.

      As far as long or 'special' brackets, again, give OID a call. He told me he has dozens of bracket styles. Direct him to this site. Your measurements are all he needs. Last I spoke with him, he said, "I won't sell a brake system that won't work." That's my experience with him. - Dave Dare
      Member, Sons of the American Revolution

      CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

      "We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
      --Lee Iacocca

      From: Royal Oak, Michigan

      Comment

      • YellowRose
        Super-Experienced


        • Jan 21 2008
        • 17188

        Disk Brake Conversion Discussion

        Dave, thanks for ALL the great technical information you have been providing us with. It is very greatly appreciated. I am sure there are a lot of others taking all this in, though they might not be saying anything.

        As far as telling OID about us, he has been following this discussion, to some extent. He told me when I talked with him on the phone that he has been on the Forum and looking at this thread. I gather as a guest because I do not know him to be a member.

        Ray Clark - Squarebirds Administrator
        The Terminator..... VTCI #11178 ITC #6000 Yellow Mustang Registry (YMR) #12188
        Contact me via Private Message for my email address, or Call (Cell) 210-875-1411

        https://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm
        Faye's Ovarian Cancer Memorial Website.
        https://faye.rayclark.info/index.html

        Comment

        • simplyconnected
          Administrator
          • May 26 2009
          • 8778

          My pleasure, Ray. I believe you have done all the running around, looking for rims and brake parts. So, most of that thanks goes to you.

          I enjoy helping others restore their Ford's. I hope I'm not giving too much info, so as to be superfluous and long in the tooth. There are many others here with a more vast experience on the subject of, retrofitting brakes. Thank You good T-bird folks for allowing me, as I feel honored to share my Galaxie's power disk brake retrofit.
          Member, Sons of the American Revolution

          CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

          "We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
          --Lee Iacocca

          From: Royal Oak, Michigan

          Comment

          • byersmtrco
            Super-Experienced
            • Sep 28 2004
            • 1839

            The brkt was put on the car years ago by San Jose Ford. I don't know why. Perhaps a booster change. It hadn't had the orig m/cyl or booster for years.

            As far as the SSBC kit, it came with the MC only. I got the booster from as local company called Power Brake Exchange (all they do is boosters & m/cyls).

            The plumbing job (which I've never been happy with) was done by the shop that installed the brk kit. At some point, I'll re-do it and make it all perty.

            It works though. It stops . . . from high speeds . . . in a straight line.

            Comment

            • YellowRose
              Super-Experienced


              • Jan 21 2008
              • 17188

              Disk Brake Conversion Discussion

              Thanks, Birthday Boy and I hope you have a very happy birthday! Well, thanks for setting me straight! That is what I get for making the assumption that it came as part of your SSBC disk brake setup! I know that some of those companies make a offset bracket like that for their systems. Would it be to much to ask for you to take some close up pix of that bracket, from several different angles? I have written OID to see if he has a bracket like that. Dave said he has a bunch of them. Maybe he has an offset bracket available that we can use. I thought it offset it off to the right somehow. Apparently it offsets it away further from the firewall to help it clear the AC plenum which is about 6-7" in depth. I wouldnt think it would be to hard to make one if you had to. I know that OID said he had a lot of different lengths of that bar that comes out of the power booster and hooks to your brakes..

              Ray Clark - Squarebirds Administrator
              The Terminator..... VTCI #11178 ITC #6000 Yellow Mustang Registry (YMR) #12188
              Contact me via Private Message for my email address, or Call (Cell) 210-875-1411

              https://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm
              Faye's Ovarian Cancer Memorial Website.
              https://faye.rayclark.info/index.html

              Comment

              • Howard Prout
                Experienced
                • Feb 11 2009
                • 443

                Further to Rays comments, it would be really helpful, John, if you could take a picture looking straight down at your booster/mc. I can't tell from your pictures but it looks like your bracket has an offset towards the fender. If the booster and mc are offset, then is the push rod on an angle? Or is the bracket long enough to place the booster ahead of the ac plenum (I know you don't have ac, John, but for those of us who do, this is an issue)? In my case, the braket would have to be about 7 " long to clear the ac plenum. If the booster and mc and then mounted on the front of such a bracket, the mc will be very close to the snorkel of the air cleaner. It would be great if OID (I hope he isn't ofended by the acronym) is listening and provide some input.
                Last edited by Howard Prout; November 8, 2009, 08:12 AM.
                sigpic "Old Betsy" - my '59 convertible J9YJ116209 Thunderbird Registry #33341

                Comment

                • simplyconnected
                  Administrator
                  • May 26 2009
                  • 8778

                  Howard, John Byers showed us this view earlier in this thread:


                  I like this side because it shows the brake line connections and the 'shelf' on the fender apron where his adjustable proportioning valve and stop light switch is mounted.

                  We are lucky he had an empty engine bay for the picture from the other side.

                  You can tell from these pictures, there is plenty of room for a bracket to extend the booster. Booster rod length is not a problem, either.
                  Member, Sons of the American Revolution

                  CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

                  "We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
                  --Lee Iacocca

                  From: Royal Oak, Michigan

                  Comment

                  • YellowRose
                    Super-Experienced


                    • Jan 21 2008
                    • 17188

                    Disk Brake Conversion Discussion

                    I received a nice piece of news today about my rims that I got from Casey! I went to Southside Auto Parts here in San Antonio to look at some rims they were getting for me from their junkyard. They told me they have a lot of 14" disk brake configured rims off of various disk brake equipped Ford cars. When I got there, I showed them one of my "14x7" inch rims painted black on one side and yellow on the front. They asked me why I thought they were 7" rims. I told them because I had measured them. Ed asked me to show him how I measured them, so I took my tape measure and measured them from rim to rim. 7"... He said that I don't have 7" rims, that I have 6" rims and that I did not measure them right. He took my measuring tape and measured them inside the rims, from bead to bead, I think he called it. He said that is how you measure width and it measured 6"!! So I am happy as all get out that I have a set of four 14x6" rims!

                    I did pick up two more 14x6" rims just like mine, disk brake ready rims. So now I have six, but the last two need to be sandblasted and painted. They sell their rims for $25 each, and if it has a tire on them, that is your responsibility to get the tire off it. Both those rims had old tires on them, which I had dismounted shortly after I bought them. It is possible that I might have three spare rims available, as I only need two for the front and one for a spare. Someone else may be interested in them first though. I will let you know.

                    These guys have been in the junkyard business for years. They told me a few things about rims that was good to know. First of all, they said that 14x7" rims are something they rarely see. 14x6" rims are the common rims on these old cars back then. They also said, (as have several others) that if you have disk brake ready rims you do not have to worry about backspacing or offsets. They will work on our Squarebirds. They also said that many rims from the early '70's into 1980 that are off disk brake equipped Ford cars will work on our Squarebirds. Here is a list they gave me.

                    '72-79 Torino & Ranchero rims. '71-73 Mustang rims. '71-79 Cougar rims. '75-80 Granada and Monarch rims. '77-'79 Tbird rims. They said those cars all used the same rims. They also said they are still fairly common rims to find and they have them. It is just a matter of them digging them out of their stuff and off their cars. They do not crush rims when they crush their cars. They told me that they parted out a '58 Tbird sometime in recent months and that people got a lot of good parts off it before it went to the crusher. I need to ask them if they have the VIN # for it. If they do, I will see if I can get it.

                    So there you have some more rims to looks for, and all those above, they claim, will work on our Squarebirds, with our original spindles. No need to swap out them. I guess one could also pull the disk brake system off any one of those cars, refurbish it and run it on our Tbirds. I don't know if I want to rely on a set of disk brakes that might have been sitting in the elements for the last several years or decades though. However, I guess one could get all the parts new for one of those cars listed above from an auto parts store....

                    Ray Clark - Squarebirds Administrator
                    The Terminator..... VTCI #11178 ITC #6000 Yellow Mustang Registry (YMR) #12188
                    Contact me via Private Message for my email address, or Call (Cell) 210-875-1411

                    https://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm
                    Faye's Ovarian Cancer Memorial Website.
                    https://faye.rayclark.info/index.html

                    Comment

                    • simplyconnected
                      Administrator
                      • May 26 2009
                      • 8778

                      Excellent job, Ray! This project got you to your first bone yard, AND you got quite an education for free. I love it.

                      Originally posted by YellowRose
                      ...I don't know if I want to rely on a set of disk brakes that might have been sitting in the elements for the last several years or decades though...
                      Junk yards throw good parts away on a daily basis. I bought (real Granada) spindles for my '55 Customline from a junk yard in FL. They looked about five Michigan winters old.

                      No, I won't spray paint and install. I took the pistons out and inspected the bores. Minor cleanup was necessary, BUT, let's say I got re-man parts from Autozone. Who's to say what they look like inside... For $10, (yep, ten bucks for seals), I had like-brand-new calipers. I bought new rotors and pads. I'm a big fan of bone yards.

                      Looks like you found the bone yd to be a treasure trove for wheels. With a little bit of research, this power disk brake project really isn't that hard. Once I had all my parts ready to go, I did my '59 in a weekend, in my driveway, including all the plumbing: Saturday, I did the spindles, mounted the prop valve, and installed the booster & M/C. Sunday I finished the plumbing and bled the system. Since I never removed my spindles, all of it was bolt-on easy. The road test felt like the brakes are from a new modern car. I was amazed.

                      I think of this: The bearings are freshly packed with the finest moly/lithium grease, the pads are new, and so are the tires and wheels. I'm good for years to come. Next time I go under those wheels it will be to bleed my DOT-3 (just to keep it fresh), and to exercise the bleeder valves.
                      Member, Sons of the American Revolution

                      CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

                      "We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
                      --Lee Iacocca

                      From: Royal Oak, Michigan

                      Comment

                      • byersmtrco
                        Super-Experienced
                        • Sep 28 2004
                        • 1839

                        Here's a couple of different angles of the m/cyl
                        (and) a few of my other mods
                        Attached Files

                        Comment

                        • byersmtrco
                          Super-Experienced
                          • Sep 28 2004
                          • 1839

                          Thanks for the B-Day wishes BTW !!!!
                          49 ??!!!!! Sheeesh !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

                          Comment

                          • Howard Prout
                            Experienced
                            • Feb 11 2009
                            • 443

                            Originally posted by byersmtrco
                            Here's a couple of different angles of the m/cyl
                            (and) a few of my other mods
                            Thanks for the pictures, John. Now I see what's going on. One last request, would you please measure the distance between the firewall and the booster, ie. how long is the bracket?

                            BTW, Scarebird's web page no longer shows a caliper mounting kit for squarebirds. Is there another source for these brackets?
                            sigpic "Old Betsy" - my '59 convertible J9YJ116209 Thunderbird Registry #33341

                            Comment

                            • byersmtrco
                              Super-Experienced
                              • Sep 28 2004
                              • 1839

                              The brkt is 4" give or take 1/8. Basically it extends the booster aprox 6" from the firewall in the recessed area where an AC Evap would go.

                              As I had previously stated, this was a factory brkt. Poss made to run a conven/booster on an AC equipped cars. If I recall, they had problems with the underdash KH unit. Low/stiff pedal. Vac asst loss, etc etc.

                              No idea why SJ Ford put this brkt on for my dad. Maybe it was part of a booster/m/cyl "kit" Ford had.

                              Comment

                              • ParTaxer
                                Apprentice
                                • Oct 8 2009
                                • 41

                                This bracket is shown attached to this brake booster on ebay.

                                Comment

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