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  • YellowRose
    Super-Experienced


    • Jan 21 2008
    • 17191

    Tbird Buy Checklist

    Considering the problems that one of our new members ran into with his Squarebird purchase recently, it was suggested by Richard Hord that we consider putting together a check list of things to look for when checking out a Tbird you are considering buying.

    There have been many comments made across many threads and posts in the past. Finding them would be difficult. I would like to have something that we could put together into the Technical Resource Library (TRL) for prospective buyers to read prior to putting their money down on something that might be a rust bucket.

    Things like: Areas or parts of the car to check for rust. (one of our members is already working on this for us) If the engine starts, what to look or listen for while it is running. Checking the oil and tranny fluids and what to look for. If you can pull the plugs, what to look for on a plug or two or more. How to check the radiator and what to look for. How to check the carb and what to look for. Driving the car and what to listen for, or look for. Quality of the interior and trunk. Paint and chrome conditions. How to check for bondo or repairs that are hidden. Brake and braking problems. Lights. And anything else you can think of that I have not listed.

    I hope this would not be to much to ask. It would be a great service to new members and old members who are going to buy a Tbird. I can ask several of our members if they mind if I use their pictures, like those showing the rust areas, and others. Between pictures and a check list of things to look for, it should be a huge help to future prospective Tbird buyers.

    I have posted this in the Squarebirds Forum, but it would also apply to other years of Tbirds. You can post your comments here and I will gather them, or you can email or PM them to me. I will compile the check list and post it in the TRL when we are finished.
    Last edited by YellowRose; February 21, 2012, 01:43 PM.

    Ray Clark - Squarebirds Administrator
    The Terminator..... VTCI #11178 ITC #6000 Yellow Mustang Registry (YMR) #12188
    Contact me via Private Message for my email address, or Call (Cell) 210-875-1411

    https://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm
    Faye's Ovarian Cancer Memorial Website.
    https://faye.rayclark.info/index.html
  • dgs
    Super-Experienced
    • Feb 13 2003
    • 962

    #2
    One thing I'd include is to be wary of claims of 'numbers matching', which I've seen in ads occasionally. Since there are no records matching engine, trans or other numbers to VINs, there is no way to prove that a Squarebird has it's original drivetrain. You can only verify that the parts were cast before the engine assy date and that the engine assy date is prior to the car's build date. That means it's possible, maybe even likely, that it's the original.

    Folks who claim 'numbers matching' don't know what they're talking about, and since there aren't any numbers to match, they're obviously making it up. What else might they have made up?

    I'd at least ask to have them show you what they mean.
    DGS (aka salguod)
    1960 Convertible - Raven Black, Red leather
    www.salguod.net

    Comment

    • jopizz
      Super-Experienced


      • Nov 23 2009
      • 8317

      #3
      Also the famous "frame off restoration" on our birds. That one really makes me laugh.
      John Pizzi - Squarebirds Administrator

      Thunderbird Registry #36223
      jopizz@squarebirds.org 856-779-9695

      https://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm

      Comment

      • NYsquarebird58
        Experienced
        • Feb 6 2012
        • 352

        #4
        Originally posted by dgs
        One thing I'd include is to be wary of claims of 'numbers matching', which I've seen in ads occasionally. Since there are no records matching engine, trans or other numbers to VINs, there is no way to prove that a Squarebird has it's original drivetrain. You can only verify that the parts were cast before the engine assy date and that the engine assy date is prior to the car's build date. That means it's possible, maybe even likely, that it's the original.

        Folks who claim 'numbers matching' don't know what they're talking about, and since there aren't any numbers to match, they're obviously making it up. What else might they have made up?

        I'd at least ask to have them show you what they mean.
        This is a really good point. I've had several inquiries on whether my car was "matching numbers" on ebay. I then take my time to explain to potential buyers that there is no way to definitively determine if the engine and trans that's in the car are the ones that were born with the car because there are no VIN numbers stamped on them. I get the the feeling from one or two potential buyers that they thought I was full of bologna so I direct them to do their own research on the internet.
        VTCI# 11860
        58HT - Thunderbird Registry Number: 37043 (Sold)

        60HT - Thunderbird Registry Number: 37252 "Lucille" (Sold)

        Comment

        • NYsquarebird58
          Experienced
          • Feb 6 2012
          • 352

          #5
          Originally posted by YellowRose
          Considering the problems that one of our new members ran into with his Squarebird purchase recently, it was suggested by Richard Hord that we consider putting together a check list of things to look for when checking out a Tbird you are considering buying.

          There have been many comments made across many threads and posts in the past. Finding them would be difficult. I would like to have something that we could put together into the Technical Resource Library (TRL) for prospective buyers to read prior to putting their money down on something that might be a rust bucket.

          Things like: Areas or parts of the car to check for rust. (one of our members is already working on this for us) If the engine starts, what to look or listen for while it is running. Checking the oil and tranny fluids and what to look for. If you can pull the plugs, what to look for on a plug or two or more. How to check the radiator and what to look for. How to check the carb and what to look for. Driving the car and what to listen for, or look for. Quality of the interior and trunk. Paint and chrome conditions. How to check for bondo or repairs that are hidden. Brake and braking problems. Lights. And anything else you can think of that I have not listed.

          I hope this would not be to much to ask. It would be a great service to new members and old members who are going to buy a Tbird. I can ask several of our members if they mind if I use their pictures, like those showing the rust areas, and others. Between pictures and a check list of things to look for, it should be a huge help to future prospective Tbird buyers.

          I have posted this in the Squarebirds Forum, but it would also apply to other years of Tbirds. You can post your comments here and I will gather them, or you can email or PM them to me. I will compile the check list and post it in the TRL when we are finished.
          I think this is a great idea. I’m glad that my experience has prompted this thought and that potential new owners could benefit and learn from it.
          VTCI# 11860
          58HT - Thunderbird Registry Number: 37043 (Sold)

          60HT - Thunderbird Registry Number: 37252 "Lucille" (Sold)

          Comment

          • YellowRose
            Super-Experienced


            • Jan 21 2008
            • 17191

            #6
            Tbird Buy Checklist

            Thank you for your input and comments. I am putting them into a Word document and building a checklist with them. Marcelo, would you object to me using the pix that you posted showing the rust areas on that Tbird? They would be good examples of what to look for when checking a car over.

            Ray Clark - Squarebirds Administrator
            The Terminator..... VTCI #11178 ITC #6000 Yellow Mustang Registry (YMR) #12188
            Contact me via Private Message for my email address, or Call (Cell) 210-875-1411

            https://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm
            Faye's Ovarian Cancer Memorial Website.
            https://faye.rayclark.info/index.html

            Comment

            • NYsquarebird58
              Experienced
              • Feb 6 2012
              • 352

              #7
              Originally posted by YellowRose
              Thank you for your input and comments. I am putting them into a Word document and building a checklist with them. Marcelo, would you object to me using the pix that you posted showing the rust areas on that Tbird? They would be good examples of what to look for when checking a car over.
              I do not object at all. Please do and I would also like to contribute more to this project. When I have some time this weekend, I'll put some notes down and maybe we can speak over the phone and have a brainstorming session. I think this will be a real asset to the forum and a really great tool for new potential buyers.
              VTCI# 11860
              58HT - Thunderbird Registry Number: 37043 (Sold)

              60HT - Thunderbird Registry Number: 37252 "Lucille" (Sold)

              Comment

              • YellowRose
                Super-Experienced


                • Jan 21 2008
                • 17191

                #8
                Tbird Buy Checklist

                Thanks, Marcelo! I need information on what to check for regarding the engine. What to listen for, what to look for in checking the oil, the spark plugs, etc.. Same for the tranny. And other areas of the car. I think we will have the rust issue taken care of shortly.

                Ray Clark - Squarebirds Administrator
                The Terminator..... VTCI #11178 ITC #6000 Yellow Mustang Registry (YMR) #12188
                Contact me via Private Message for my email address, or Call (Cell) 210-875-1411

                https://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm
                Faye's Ovarian Cancer Memorial Website.
                https://faye.rayclark.info/index.html

                Comment

                • NYsquarebird58
                  Experienced
                  • Feb 6 2012
                  • 352

                  #9
                  Originally posted by YellowRose
                  Thanks, Marcelo! I need information on what to check for regarding the engine. What to listen for, what to look for in checking the oil, the spark plugs, etc.. Same for the tranny. And other areas of the car. I think we will have the rust issue taken care of shortly.
                  It would be great if we could get Mr. Dare to collaborate on this. His wisdom on all things mechanical would be a great.
                  VTCI# 11860
                  58HT - Thunderbird Registry Number: 37043 (Sold)

                  60HT - Thunderbird Registry Number: 37252 "Lucille" (Sold)

                  Comment

                  • YellowRose
                    Super-Experienced


                    • Jan 21 2008
                    • 17191

                    #10
                    Tbird Buy Checklist

                    I have been researching '55-'66 Data Plates, what they look like, and how to tell if they have been replaced. Also where they are located at. I have pictures of them in the checklist also. So I think I have that covered pretty well.

                    Ray Clark - Squarebirds Administrator
                    The Terminator..... VTCI #11178 ITC #6000 Yellow Mustang Registry (YMR) #12188
                    Contact me via Private Message for my email address, or Call (Cell) 210-875-1411

                    https://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm
                    Faye's Ovarian Cancer Memorial Website.
                    https://faye.rayclark.info/index.html

                    Comment

                    • Mickfly70
                      Apprentice
                      • Oct 20 2010
                      • 83

                      #11
                      I have just finished reading this book called "The Checklist Manifesto" Its about a doctor working for the WHO (World Health Organization) that tries to introduce checklist to the medical world. He succeeds, however, there was a lot to learn about how to make an effective checklist. Most of his research came from the aviation industry.

                      I think this "Buying a Tbird" Checklist is an awesome idea. One idea that I'd like to input in the building of this is not to have the checklist too detailed. Being a professional seaplane pilot and dealing with checklist on a daily manner I would suggest a 2 part approach.

                      Part 1: The checklist. i.e. point form. Major heading/systems
                      saying check this....check that. (like a professional checklist). This is the one page printout that you take along when you look at the car. (after reading the "detailed" multiple page document on 'what to look for when buying a Ford Thunderbird'

                      Part 2: The Detail. All the pictures and suggestions on what to specifically look for in each area of the car. Like the Flight manual. With all the experience in this forum, this section could easily blowout to 50+ pages. Thats good. Thats what you read in the days before looking at a car. The "checklist" is what you take on the day.

                      Anyway. Thats my 2 canadian cents worth
                      Mick Egan Vancouver Island Canada
                      60 Tbird

                      Comment

                      • YellowRose
                        Super-Experienced


                        • Jan 21 2008
                        • 17191

                        #12
                        Tbird Buy Checklist

                        Thank you for the input, Mick. Point well taken and I can certainly build it that way. A "bullet" part with the major things to check to take with you, and a "detail" part to review before doing so. It makes sense to me. Thank you for the suggestions, as they are much appreciated.

                        Ray Clark - Squarebirds Administrator
                        The Terminator..... VTCI #11178 ITC #6000 Yellow Mustang Registry (YMR) #12188
                        Contact me via Private Message for my email address, or Call (Cell) 210-875-1411

                        https://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm
                        Faye's Ovarian Cancer Memorial Website.
                        https://faye.rayclark.info/index.html

                        Comment

                        • partsetal
                          Super-Experienced
                          • Jun 4 2005
                          • 852

                          #13
                          Ray,
                          I'm for the shorter checklist because it can be one that can be referenced in that first phone call to see if it is worth travelling to see. While inspecting the car, the user could rate each category on a scale of 1 to 5 which would be an aid in price negotiations and also in comparing more than one vehicle.
                          Many of the correctness details are covered in the VTCI standards which can be referenced at a later time.

                          Carl

                          Comment

                          • Anders
                            Super-Experienced
                            • Jan 19 2008
                            • 2213

                            #14
                            I always use this method:
                            Attached Files
                            sigpic..."Lil darling Ruth":)
                            http://www.tbirdregistry.com/#33158

                            Comment

                            • Restifier52
                              Experienced
                              • Jul 26 2011
                              • 370

                              #15
                              That's about where I'm at.
                              1960 HT
                              Thunderbird Registry #35780

                              Comment

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