calif smog setup

[Guest]

hi everyone, car has been running good, so i havent been on here for awhile. i was wondering if anyone can explain the smog crap that was required of older cars in calif. they did this by by drilling an ell fitting into the top rear of the intake manifold with a rubber hose going to a cone shaped device located over the passenger side valve cover,thermador is inscribed on the device, with a hole drilled into the valve cover so the device can insert, then the rubber hose continues to another ell fitting drilled into the top front of the intake manifold. i thought about replacing the valve cover and running a straight tube from one ell fitting to the other to clean it up temporarily, then if i rebuild the engine, just tap out the holes and use plugs on the intake manifold.does anyone know what this setup does, and if the temp clean up would work? i have photos of this setup if you need to see it.

also was wondering if anyone has used carburetors u.s.a. in new jersey to rebuild their carb. i've had bad luck w/ rebuild kits that contain plastic parts labeled o.e.m., original equip match. this company looks to be reputable, so i'm planning on sending my carter carb to them to for rebuild. any info would be helpful

[tbirdave]

RE: calif smog setup

Someone has been messing with your car doing their own thing. Probably to get rid of the exess blow by that these cars can have, it tends to go into the cab. As for the carb, I put in an Edelbrok and it works great. You can get one at any auto parts store. Make sure it is fitted with the auto choke. tbirdave P.S. I have an Edelbrok carb that needs to be cleaned and a auto choke attached. I will sell it to you . If interested e-mail me daveweltner@sbcglobal.net

[Alexander]

RE: calif smog setup

I think someone post here a while ago about the PCV systems that were installed in California in the seventies on older cars. There are better and neater ways of doing this. There are carb spacer adapters that have connections for a PCV valve. Other more presentable ways of putting in a PCV valve system are shown the main Squarebirds site in the technical section.

Please post a picture of your current setup.

Alexander
1959 Hardtop
1960 Golde Top

[byersmtrco]

RE: calif smog setup

Calif doesn't reg veh's built prior to 1974 to pass smog (unless you get reported as a gross pollutor.
Mine does have the late 60's eary 70's (Ford Dealer installed) PCV syst. Runs clean, no odors. Dirties the air filter up faster.

John

[dgs]

RE: calif smog setup

Granddad bought my '60 from the original owner in the Los Angeles area in 1978. It's got holes drilled in the passenger side of the air cleaner for an 'L' fitting to accept a heater hose. The other end of the hose is attached to the breather, I think is what it's called.

Don't know who did it or why, but it was done in CA. No PCV valve that I know about.

Doesn't help with your situation though, sorry.

[KULTULZ]

RE: calif smog setup

>Granddad bought my '60 from the original owner in the Los
>Angeles area in 1978. It's got holes drilled in the
>passenger side of the air cleaner for an 'L' fitting to
>accept a heater hose. The other end of the hose is attached
>to the breather, I think is what it's called.
>
>Don't know who did it or why, but it was done in CA. No PCV
>valve that I know about.

This was done primarily to prevent the Road Draft-Open Emission Sytem used prior to PCV (CA 1961) permitting crankcase fumes from escaping into the atmosphere (via open filtered oil filler cap). The crankcase drew (hopefully) clean(er) air from the air cleaner cannister (not very efficient unless the source of air is drawn from inside the filter element or a separate element is used- side filter).

SQUAREBIRD TECH ARTICLE ON PCV UPGRADE;

http://www.squarebirds.org/pcv_conversion.htm

Here is a photo of a commercially available conversion kit;

http://hotrodders.com/gallery/data/500/FE-early_PCV_Conversion_3_TBIRD_RANCH.jpg

I would run a section of steel tubing as the hose in the above photo is on the verge of collapse.

[Alexander]

RE: calif smog setup

Sean sent me some picture of his California smogger equipment.

http://www.squarebirds.org/smog/smog-setup.jpg

http://www.squarebirds.org/smog/valve-cover-fitting.jpg

http://www.squarebirds.org/smog/valve-cover-fitting2.jpg

http://www.squarebirds.org/smog/manifold-fitting.jpg

http://www.squarebirds.org/smog/manifold-fitting2.jpg

Is there a PCV fitting in that contraption on valve cover? I wonder why two fittings were put into the intake manifold instead of just one. I assume the hole for the manifold vent tube has been plugged.

I do not like the aesthetics of this system. If it were my car, I remove the fittings and seal the holes, returning the car to original. If necessary, I would get a new valve cover and manifold. If I wanted to put in a PCV system I would put in one that is more visual pleasing and less anachronistic. Many people on this site have put in PCV systems. They look better than this.

Alexander
1959 Hardtop
1960 Golde Top

[KULTULZ]

Emmissions Reduction Kit

>Sean sent me some picture of his California smogger
>equipment.
>
>Is there a PCV fitting in that contraption on valve cover? I
>wonder why two fittings were put into the intake manifold
>instead of just one. I assume the hole for the manifold vent
>tube has been plugged.
>
>I do not like the aesthetics of this system. If it were my
>car, I remove the fittings and seal the holes, returning the
>car to original. If necessary, I would get a new valve cover
>and manifold. If I wanted to put in a PCV system I would put
>in one that is more visual pleasing and less anachronistic.
>Many people on this site have put in PCV systems. They look
>better than this.

It appears to have a diaphram inside of it. It is either an oil separator or accessory PCV valve. FORD did offer Emmission Reduction Kits in the early sixties and I think I remember reading where CA required this on older models as the PVC installation came mandatory in 1961 (CA).

MPC lists a Emmissions Reduction Kit (Basic PN 6A603) and lists one especially for the 60 BIRD. I have no cataloging prior to 1960.

It appears the kit has a vacuum signal at both front and rear runners (correct design is to have the vacuum signal sourced from the plenun so as to distribute the fumes to all cylinders for even burn).

If it is decided to remove it and go back to Road Draft or a later PCV installation, I would save those parts.

[KULTULZ]

Uh...sheesh...

After focusing on the photos awhile...This appears to be a 430.

I was in cataloging for a 352 and just went back for a kit number for the 430. None is listed (it may have been deleted before Final Issue) (or this may be an FE kit modified to fit) (or the dual signal source in the intake runners may signal OEM 430 rather than just removing the FE road draft tube and modifying it as shown elsewheres here).

It is much more difficult to retrofit a PCV system on an early 430 than 352 because of top engine design. You would need to find a later (61/ ) valley pan and modify the road draft intake tube below it.

[JBird]

RE: calif smog setup

How do you shave an inch off the top of the air cleaner with that rig? You can hardly close the hood on a squarebird now and with give in the motor mounts... My hood scoop had a dimple from the all thread bolt and the air cleaner prevented the hood from closing so the car didn't have any air cleaner when I bought it.

My 430 had that cali crap on it and it's all gone now and back original. The extra spacer under my carb sucked blowby into the intake from the passenger valve cover through a PCV valve.

Smog? What's that???

J-Bird
Visalia, Cali XXXX Kalistan

http://www.tbirdregistry.com/extra/rn26200.htm

http://www.tbirdregistry.com/images/RN/rn26200e.jpg

[Guest]

RE: calif smog setup

thanks for all your input re: the smog crap on my 430. looks like the bottom line is to replace the manifold and valve cover. in the meantime, does it look possible to run a tube between the two ell fittings and replace the valve cover, just to clean it up a bit in case the manifold is hard to find? p.s. the air here in southern calif is still brown.

[byersmtrco]

RE: calif smog setup

Alexander,

Will the early 60's 430 Linc/Merc setup work on his deal?
I've never seen the smog set up on a TB with a J motor, but "maybe" on one of the big Lincolns? I don't know? Does that sound right?
John

[JBird]

RE: calif smog setup

>Alexander,
>
>Will the early 60's 430 Linc/Merc setup work on his deal?
>I've never seen the smog set up on a TB with a J motor, but
>"maybe" on one of the big Lincolns? I don't know? Does that
>sound right?
>John


Actually the mill is from a 1961 Lincoln. The 59 J motor is long gone. Around 62 there were PCV retrofit kits out there. This motor had the breather pipe pulled and the hole under the intake was plugged. Ring blowby was sucked out and reburned the blowby with the hose under the carb. The snorkle was brazed onto the valve cover and two small holes were torch cut through the valve cover into the hole in the snorkle. Then a PCV valve was added.

My project car was a typical depression era car with parts from many cars. The AC system and condensor, compressor and lines are off a 1962 T-Bird. It's been a 1 year scavenger hunt buying parts. I'm very close now with all the original parts ready. Although the engine is still a 61 it's visual to an early 1959 T-Bird with a 58 Lincoln engine. The new valve covers are period correct with metal combs and rubber grommets on the wires.

The Autolite 4100 carb is now the 2853s Carter AFB with the correct air cleaner with the thermostat and heat shield. The (1961) C1VE Lincoln water pump with incorrect pulleys is now 1959 correct for an A/C car as is the compressor and clutch.

The compressor bracket, condensor, A/C linesm and sight glass are now original and I just got the correct brackets for the A/C lines from Concours.

The breather pipe is now back and correct with a professionally rebuilt 430 and tranny.

I have a ton of cash in this car just because I want it back the way if looked when new. I have new foam on the seats, new black leather covers, new door and kick panels, new dash pad, new carpet and headliner and all new NOS FoMoCo gages and speedo head. All the chrome work is done.

I'm welding new metal now. New floor pans too and the car is stripped bare and will soon be in primer so I can put the drive train back in and hook up all the lines.

New insulation now for thew firewall and another year will roll by before it's show ready.

Glass.... wire harnesses ... when will it ever end.

Then paint.

I'll be lucky if it's woth half of what is in it but it's not for sale. This gets passed on to my kids when I'm gone let them fight over it.

[KULTULZ]

RE: calif smog setup

>How do you shave an inch off the top of the air cleaner with
>that rig? You can hardly close the hood on a squarebird now
>and with give in the motor mounts... My hood scoop had a
>dimple from the all thread bolt and the air cleaner
>prevented the hood from closing so the car didn't have any
>air cleaner when I bought it.
>
>My 430 had that cali crap on it and it's all gone now and
>back original. The extra spacer under my carb sucked blowby
>into the intake from the passenger valve cover through a PCV
>valve.
>
>J-Bird

http://www.tbirdregistry.com/images/RN/rn26200e.jpg

Yours J-Bird appears to be the kit for the 352 installed the hard way (brazing of tube onto rocker cover). The use of a carb spacer raised the carb enough to interfere with the hood. It appears the 430 kit did not use that spacer but had two separate vacuum signals (to distribute the blow-by fumes somewhat evenly in the engine).

http://www.squarebirds.org/smog/smog-setup.jpg

I cannot believe a modification kit would call for the modification of a rocker cover in that fashion. A hole drilled yes, an intake tube, no.

[KULTULZ]

RE: calif smog setup

>thanks for all your input re: the smog crap on my 430. looks
>like the bottom line is to replace the manifold and valve
>cover. in the meantime, does it look possible to run a tube
>between the two ell fittings and replace the valve cover,
>just to clean it up a bit in case the manifold is hard to
>find? p.s. the air here in southern calif is still brown.

http://www.squarebirds.org/smog/smog-setup.jpg

Were the fittings into the intake tapped and threaded or were they brazed? If threaded, just remove and replace with pipe plugs. If brazed, a hose between the two fittings will allow the removal of the system.

A thought, if you remove the fittings if brazed, you can tap pipe threads into the holes to accept plugs. Most likely unoticeable and save you some money unless you come across an intake cheaply.