Edelbrock 1406 Question

[YellowRose]

Edelbrock 1406 Question

Hi Franco,

The distributor cap and rotor are pretty new. A few days ago, I had them both off and inspected them thoroughly under a flashlight. I did not see anything in the way of cracks or any other problems. However, it would not be a bad idea to replace them again, just in case.

As for checking for proper positioning of the dist, that will get done Monday morning. I know that needs to be verified and if wrong, fixed. If it is positioned right, that will be another thing checked and out of the way. Thanks for all the help, guys!

[cruciform]

I'm having the same exact problem, although my engine is stock. I have 50k on it, and it runs perfectly at idle, but it doesn't have any power. It will run and drive, but the distributor isn't advancing like it should, and the secondaries aren't opening on the cab.. so my best guess is an intake manifold leak. seeing as this sucker weighs like 85 lbs, I need 2 people to remove it. If you resolve your problem, let me know.. I'm dyin here too!

Percy.
60 t-bird, satin black.

[byersmtrco]

If you have the factory service manual, go to page1-21 in the 352 eng section. Look at illust # A107 3A (Fig 4) at the bottom of the page.
It shows the placemet of the weight on the outside.

If you don't have a svc manual, look at the valve. the weight should be pointing almost straight down into that indent in the frame (an afterthought??). That is if the valve is in the OPEN posn. Mine is stuck open.

Hope that helps.

[byersmtrco]

Sorry about being unclear here, I was reffering to the EFE (flapper) valve in the pass side exh/manif.

If you have the factory service manual, go to page1-21 in the 352 eng section. Look at illust # A107 3A (Fig 4) at the bottom of the page.
It shows the placemet of the weight on the outside.

If you don't have a svc manual, look at the valve. the weight should be pointing almost straight down into that indent in the frame (an afterthought??). That is if the valve is in the OPEN posn. Mine is stuck open.

Hope that helps.

[byersmtrco]

On the dist cap deal. Get a Motorcraft cap. The #1 tower is marked.
Look at the dist cap retainer in back(facing the rr of the car)
The #1 wire is the 1st one clockwise from that retainer clip. (The dist rotates counter clock-wise)
Turn the eng over manually (1 1/8? socket on the frt of the crank)
Get it deadnuts on # 1 on the compression stroke. Then just make sure the rotor is pointing (exactly) @ the #1 wire posn.
I'd bet real money you're off a tooth.

[YellowRose]

Edelbrock 1406 Question

Hi John,

Thanks for all the good info. I have been trying to track down a Motorcraft dist cap, but it looks like none of the major parts places around me (and there are about six of them) have it in stock. I like the idea of having a cap with the #1 tower being marked. Mine is just a generic cap, but pretty new.

Once I go through the procedure to see if the dist is lined up right and the rotor is NOT pointing exactly at the #1 wire position, then what? If I am off a tooth, what has to be done next to get it lined up? I suspect I know. The timing chain has to come off, be inspected, possibly replaced, aligned, etc?? That means the entire front end of the stuff in front of the engine has to be taken off, right? Hood, Radiator, fan belts, fan harmonic balancer, A/C compressor, etc..? If that is the case, that is going to be an expensive job.

[Guest]

Ray
Sorry to hear you are still having problems. In shop manual for 1959 under Ignition System section 2-6 have you read Dist test & Adj. I din't know it but it states that the Dist. has two independently operated spark advance systems.if you do not have this page I will try to /e-Mail or fax it to you.
I did not read the instruction sheet for the 1406 before I took my old carb off,but I was to check the vac. port on the old carb before I took the old carb off to see if I had Vacum at idle or when i increased the RPM and then I would have known which port to use.SO I look at the picture of the 1406 cab on the installation insturctions. faceing the carb the port on the left of passengers side is for emmissions controlled engines and the port on the left or drivers side is for non-emissions engines, that is why I used the port on the left I read Bill's note now I don't know if I am right or wrong but my car runs like a scared rabbit,let me know which side runs best for you.
Bob M

[FeFranco]

Hold everything! I believe you need a mechanic to check it out. I am curious, though, when did your car start acting up like this? Did you buy the car like this? Did it, one day out of the blue, just go south on you? Something is missing, so start from the beginning.

[YellowRose]

Edelbrock 1406 Question

Hi Bob,

Thanks for the information. I have just read that section you told me about regarding dist test & adj. Interesting reading! I will have my shop manual with me in the morning, when we tackle this problem again.

As for which side to put the vacuum tubing to, my mechanic friend determined that it should go on the left or passenger side. But after what you said and the diagram shows, since, I gather these '58-'60 Birds have no emission controls, that vacuum tube should be on the right or drivers side. I think we tried that already, but it did not make any difference. In the morning, I will try that again, just to be sure, before we start doing other things.

Franco, this Bird was like this when I bought it six months ago. My mechanic friend was with me, and checked the car out inside and out pretty well. We knew it had this problem, but he said it was something that we could find and fix. Well, up until the last few weeks, he and I have been working on other things, like the brakes, electrical wiring problems, getting the gauges to work again, and the clock, replacing the generator with an alternator, replacing the gas sending unit and the gas tank, chroming parts, finding and fixing the rough idle problem which turned out to be bad spark plug cables, or cable. All along, it has had this problem of sluggish get up and go, sometimes dying on us. We had the idle set a little high to try to stop that, but that is not to good of an idea for it to be set to high so I am told.

So now I have been concentrating on finding and fixing this sluggish, dying, engine problem. That is where I am at now. So far, the spark plugs and wires have been replaced, new vacuum advance cone, new carb, timing has been checked, set and reset numerous times, voltages have been checked. There is 9.3v at the + side of the coil, which, according to Pertronix is sufficient voltage. They say anything above 7.5v to 12v is sufficient. I need to check the ohm reading. There should be 1.50ohms between the -/+ side with the wiring disconnected. I might have a loopy coil. It could be any number of things.

Tbird, that is the first time I have heard about a pigtail under the dist plate! No one has told me anything about that. If you don't mind explaining that in a PM to me I would appreciate it. I fear I am cluttering up this forum with to much of my problems.

Once again, thanks for all the help. It is very, very much appreciated.

[Guest]

Not to add any more confussion here but has anyone checked the pig tail under the dist. plate? Just a thought.

[byersmtrco]

Pigtail?

There is a ground strap. On the pertronix unit you have a (red)lead that also goes to the poss si of the coil (Black lead goes to the neg si. Then there is a ground strap.

I doubt (although I would still check) that your t/chain is off a tooth.
Maybe sloppy. I would just check it to be sure.
It is more likely that either the dist is off a tooth and/or the balancer has slipped (very common) and you are getting a bad reading w/the tmg light.

After those items are checked off, and it sounds like you've already checked for voltage drop, I'd set the timing at 8-10 deg before TDC. Make sure you're checking with the vac line to the dist discon & plugged off.

[Guest]

Ray
I am enjoying reading these post it has made all us barn yard mechanics get the books out and read a little bit. now you give me a old F20 Farmall and I could fix it with bailing wire
Keep us posted
Bbo M

[YellowRose]

Edelbrock 1406 Question

Hi Bob & John,

I appreciate what Bob said. I also know I am not the only one having this problem with sluggishness while trying to drive under load conditions. So maybe what is being posted here will not only fix my problem, but allow him or anyone else in the future to fix theirs.

John, thanks for explaining to me what pigtail meant. Yes, I know about the ground strap and it has been checked, and is tight. Yup, the red lead from the Pertronix is going to the + side of the coil, and the black lead from it to the - side of the coil, and both are tight. So that is right.

I hope you are right about the t/chain situation. That will be great news if it is okay. The timing has been checked with a timing light and we might be getting a bad reading. I understand that the rubber can dry out between the harmonic balancer halves and cause one of them to slip, causing the reading to be off. We are going to try what Alexander said to do in one of his previous posts. He said "Don't use a timing light for setting your timing. Often the rubber in the harmonic balancer shifts so you will get inaccurate readings. Set it to maximum RPM and vacuum. If the motor pings on acceleration, retard the time slightly so there is no or slight pinging."

I do know that timing adjustments have been made with the vac line to the dist disconnected and plugged off. I think they also made timing adjustments without the timing light, trying to advance the timing. If they did not, I will suggest they do what Alexander said to do. In fact, I am printing a lot of things out to take with me to the shop in the morning.

Thanks again for all the help!

[Guest]

Sorry I'm still runnin points.

[byersmtrco]

That's different than my antique version.
I'd follow the directions (I know - I know) and run the vac adv off the non emis port (L/H Drvrs side)

Now they have a port for the evap/cnstr too ? Hmmm.

Ray
Sorry to hear you are still having problems. In shop manual for 1959 under Ignition System section 2-6 have you read Dist test & Adj. I din't know it but it states that the Dist. has two independently operated spark advance systems.if you do not have this page I will try to /e-Mail or fax it to you.
I did not read the instruction sheet for the 1406 before I took my old carb off,but I was to check the vac. port on the old carb before I took the old carb off to see if I had Vacum at idle or when i increased the RPM and then I would have known which port to use.SO I look at the picture of the 1406 cab on the installation insturctions. faceing the carb the port on the left of passengers side is for emmissions controlled engines and the port on the left or drivers side is for non-emissions engines, that is why I used the port on the left I read Bill's note now I don't know if I am right or wrong but my car runs like a scared rabbit,let me know which side runs best for you.
Bob M