new to forum requesting overheating help!

[smittybuilt]

im smitty, i own a 60 bird. had her for over ten years.. little history: baught her in 2000 as well as a 59(they came as a pair) drove her for 5 years were the most work i had to do was a timing chain replacement on her then the lower a arm dropped and put her outta service.. after a few years i got her back together.. completely rebuilt her front end put a fresh rebuilt 390 and a tranny out of a 66 mercury. all new everything for the engine... including a high flow 10 blade water pump i beleave it was...got her running and she ran hot so i put a new radiator from cap-a radiator.. a big 3 core high flow and installed a fan shoud( a real one not the repro glass one) as well as a 7 blade fan and clutch.. i live in henderson just out side of las vegas where its 100 degrees at night in the summer. i can drive her for a bit but she keeps rising in temp.. any help would be much appreciated.

[JohnG]

Suggestions:

* Calibrate your temp gauge so you get some actual readings and/or get a temp gun so you can pinpoint different areas.

* do a thorough flush of the cooling system.

* back off on the ignition timing some

* go with a heat range cooler plug

* get the idle speed down as low as possible so you aren't generating excess heat while idling at stop signs and lights.

* make sure your fan is not too far into the shroud. If it is too far in, I am told it generates turbulence and reduced air flow.

Is there any chance your water pump is circulating water too fast??

John

[KULTULZ]

i live in henderson just out side of las vegas where its 100 degrees at night in the summer. i can drive her for a bit but she keeps rising in temp.. any help would be much appreciated.

JohnG made all good points.

In addition, considering where you live, you might consider an engine oil cooler, a remote trans and PS cooler.

[JohnG]

As on modern cars, have the pressure relief go into an overflow container set up so it gets sucked back in when cool. This will help to keep the coolant level where you want it. (and toxic liquids off the pavement)

What rating is your radiator cap?

There are some cooling system additives on the market (one that comes to mind is Liquid Kool) which help the cooling system to function a tad more efficiently.

My worst fear on such a day is I get off of the highway, having been at highway speed, and immediately get stuck at a red light or in traffic. If your fan is electric then you can remove some heat. A conventional one is moving slowly at the low engine speed so not helping alot. But there is alot of heat there to deal with.

What weight oil do you use???

[ayrwoof]

over heater

i use the otterzone temp gun to deturmine engine temps
i put a metal fan shroud on mine with be cool 6 blade stainless flex
fan. this helped alot but not all.
then i realized the exhaust was so old , i hung in under there in 1979.
SO since i worked for a muffler shop i folded up new tubes from my old
ones as pattern nixed the 2" pipe for 2 1/4" and three chamber muffs
with formal 21/4" down turns properly trimmed. this killed my heat
the exhaust was too small.. 2 1/2" pipe would have been too loud
this works and lets more heat AWAY FROM the motor.

[ayrwoof]

over heater

oh i forgot , i added a brass wire to the lower radiator hose
i thought the high suction at road speed would suck
the lower hose (colapsed ) ..

[simplyconnected]

Check your heat riser valve on your exhaust manifold. It's an easy thing to overlook. When they stick, it's always in the closed position. A stuck heat riser forces the cooling system to get rid of exhaust heat running through the intake manifold. - Dave

[smittybuilt]

ok ill try to answer all of these.. my fan is sticking into the shroud about half way... i have a fan clutch on it so it spins pretty well... i use 20-50 in the summer and 10-40 in the winter (have all my life with all my old fords) no idea about the calibration but im planning on getting a 3 gauge cluster under dash mount type from moon or make my own for temp/oil/volt. i completely removed power steering pump.. straight pipes through original exhaust.. disconnected heat collector.. i have an external trans cooler( haha after i got my new tranny and engine in and fired up on the maiden voyage my newly rebuilt radiator malfunctioned mixing the trans fluid and coolant completely destroying my fresh built trans.. after having the trans rebuilt again, this time on the radiator shops dime, i installed the external cooler.) i completely flushed the engine cooling system using simple green/water mix several times, gradually reducing the mix until i was flushing with straight water and the simple green was completely out of my system... anyway i hope i answered everything.. like i said the thing has always over heated so thats why ive tried to take the extra measures when i installed the new parts into my car. the engine and trans run great.. could drive the sucker anywere i wanted to besides that overheating problem.. that keeps me from kicking the tires and putting serious miles on my car which is what id love to do again..

[Guest]

More questions for you

Hi; Just a few more questions for you.
What temp is it running ? You need to put a temp guage on it to get an accurate reading. Is it getting hot enough to blow the coolant out and how fast does it get hot ?

What thermostat are you running and I know this might be a dumb question but is the thermostat in right. I have seen them in backwards. You should be running a 13-15 lb. pressure cap also. You do need to run a thermostat if you don't have one in there.

Does it get hot running down the road or just when idling at lights and such?

Also do NOT run straight water for coolant. I know it never gets cold enough in Henderson for a freezing problem but coolant is necessary.


Gary

[Dakota Boy]

I run about 20% anti-freeze, the rest is tap water.

Plus....the magical liquid..... a bottle of "Water Wetter". Available at most auto parts stores.

Works very well for my transplanted 460 with the stock T-bird radiator, a flex-fan, and no shroud.

[smittybuilt]

its not getting hot enough to blow it out.. ill stop before it gets to that point.. it gets hot relatively fast especially in stop and go.. im not running straight water in it as this causes rust and a whole bunch of other corrosive elements also the tap water out here is pretty hard so i use distilled water in a 50/50 mix.. also i ran without a thermostat it in for 5 years and never had an issue with not running one.. but with the new engine i did install one and yes its in there correctly haha.. why do you suggest running one? what are the downfall with not running one besides the obvious cold weather warm up issue..

[smittybuilt]

i just ran my bird for a bit in the garage and at idle i notices the temp needle at the begining of the "m" on the "temp" it was on the first down leg and would bounce to the second leg on the m and then back again it did this several times until it warmed up more and stayed just passed the m... i have noticed this spiking happening while ive been sitting at red lights before... hope thats useful info..

[simplyconnected]

...i completely removed power steering pump.. straight pipes through original exhaust.. disconnected heat collector...

So, NO heat riser valve?

...i completely flushed the engine cooling system using simple green/water mix several times, gradually reducing the mix until i was flushing with straight water and the simple green was completely out of my system...

...like i said the thing has always over heated...

This sounds like straight water with no water pump lubrication or anti-rust agents.
Your engine didn't always overheat, and it shouldn't, now. Two questions:
What temperature is it actually going up to?
Have the head gaskets ever been replaced?

...im not running straight water in it as this causes rust and a whole bunch of other corrosive elements also the tap water out here is pretty hard so i use distilled water in a 50/50 mix...

HUH?
Ok, exactly what kind of coolant are you using?

I agree with prior posts that advocate for cooling systems under pressure. Each degree of PSI will raise your boiling point three degrees.
Example: Water boils at sea level at 212*F. Add a seven pound cap (3 times 7 =21) and your boiling point just went up to (212 + 21 =) 233 degrees F.
Sixteen PSI raises the boiling point to over 255*F. <--Engines LOVE this operating temp, causing them to last longer, and burn more efficiently (like modern engines).

Running without a thermostat is not bad at all. Just be sure the system flows with plenty of water flow AND air flow. Radiators work best with a WIDE temperature difference between the air and coolant (like in the winter time). - Dave

[smittybuilt]

the system is a 50/50 mix right now with prestone and distilled water..the engine is a fresh rebuilt motor so the head gaskets or any other internal engine problem should be out of the question.. and yes there is a heat riser valve but i disconnected the spring at fixed the flapper to open all the time.. not sure about the actual temp the engine is getting to i just know after a few miles of driving it the temp goes from warm then gradually increases to the hot.. then ive noticed the engine starts running crappy at idle

[JohnG]

It would be good if you could find out what actual temps correspond to the readings on your Temp gauge.

There are two ways I can think of, depending on what temp gauge you can get your hands on:

1) get a temp gun like Harbor Freight has (maybe $35 unless on sale) and measure right where the sending unit is, under a variety of conditions, writing them down (ideally for each letter on the gauge)

2) if you have a more traditional thermometer (like from a chemistry lab) you can remove the sending unit, immerse it in just boiled water with the lead to the car hooked up and a jumper to ground and, with the key On or Acc, record the temp and gauge location as it cools.

General Question: what is "too hot" ?? At what temp are you threatening harm to the motor?

General opinion: a thermostat only keeps you from running too cool, not too hot (unless it fails closed). Once it's open, it's irrelevant.

john