1960 TBIRD- WHAT ENGINE??

[Alexander]

RE: 1960 TBIRD- WHAT ENGINE??

The exhaust manifolds are interchangable on the 390 and 352 FE.

I really should say can be interchangable, since there were bolt location changes for the manifolds through the design evolution of the FE & FT engines.

Alexander
1959 Hardtop
1960 Golde Top

[Guest]

RE: 1960 TBIRD- WHAT ENGINE??

Hi Alexander!

Still trying to get this engine Question to bed. I do believe I have a 64 Tbird 390? Why, I saw 64 thru 66 Tbird engines & mine matches the 64. The 65 & 66 have their oil filler on the drv side in the valve cover, mine is on the block on the psgr side. However, the P/S pump is definetely from a 65-66, this may explain the misalignment problem.

Question, if this is true, could I use the 64 P/S pump? Are the hose fittings the same? I am not sure of the bracket situation. I do have a nice pix of my engine and of a 64 & 66 if I can send it too you. Any thoughts???

Thanks- Jack

[Alexander]

RE: 1960 TBIRD- WHAT ENGINE??

You can e-mail me the pictures webmaster@squarebirds.org .

The later power steering pumps are not much different than the Squarebird pumps. The hose endings might be different, but they still can be adpated for use.

Alexander
1959 Hardtop
1960 Golde Top

[Alexander]

RE: 1960 TBIRD- WHAT ENGINE??

These are pictures of Jack's 1960 T-Bird with the probable 390 engine.

http://squarebirds.org/images/60tbird-390.jpg

http://squarebirds.org/images/60tbird-390-1.jpg

http://squarebirds.org/images/60tbird-390-2.jpg

This a 1964 T-Bird 390 engine compartment:

http://squarebirds.org/images/64tbird-390.jpg

This a 1966 T-Bird 390 engine compartment:

http://squarebirds.org/images/66tbird-390.jpg

As you can see the style of power pumps changed over the years.

Alexander
1959 Hardtop
1960 Golde Top

[Alexander]

RE: 1960 TBIRD- WHAT ENGINE??

I think one of the problems you have is that you have what looks like a 1958-59 A/C type fan pulley. This pulley has a space between two pulleys. Do you have two or three pullies on the crankshaft? I don't think the later power steering pumps will align with this set-up.

I believe I have photos of the fan belt arrangement for 1959 and 1960 Thunderbirds on my computer at home. I will post them when I find it.

Alexander
1959 Hardtop
1960 Golde Top

[tmjsong1aolcom]

RE: 1960 TBIRD- WHAT ENGINE??

In viewing the pis your power steering pump is at least in bird cronology for a 65 and later tbird. In fact the 65 used the same one as the 64 unles equipped with A/C.

As for identifing your engine, this gets really fun with Fords. As stated earlier you have a 64 block. What the hp rating is from what I understand is you have to measre the bore and stroke.

Lokk at the intake manifold there should be a casting number in front of the carb. This will at least get you to a year.

You can also pull this info off the exhaust manifolds and the heads. Besides the casting numbers you will also find usually between to cast screw heads the date each piece was cast. The only thing this will all do for you is identify when each piece was built.

If you post we should be able to decode most of it for you.

Good Luck
Fuz
58's&64's

[Guest]

RE: 1960 TBIRD- WHAT ENGINE??

Hi Alexander!

I have 2 pulley setup on Crankshaft and yes 3 on the water pump. Saturday, I put things together. I used a 1/8" washer on the top right of block and just slightly bent the bracket forward. (very slightly) Now the pump aligns along with the generator. The generator bracket was cracked and I had it welded. I believe that was the gen alignment problem. I hope that holds.

However, concerning the P/S pulley, the guys at Auto zone( They lend out tools for just a deposit) gave me the wrong puller and it bent the pulley so now I need to get a pulley for a 65 Tbird, because that the newer pump. So I'll need to take out the pump again and reinstall. No problem, I can do it in my sleep.

Thanks for posting the pictures etc. and the tips. When i get the new pulley I can fully test everything correctly. Hopefully this will work!

Take Care!

Jack

[Guest]

RE: 1960 TBIRD- WHAT ENGINE??

Thanks Fuzz!

That was most helpful. I have accepted the fact that it is a 64 390 engine, but I don't know the HP. I can tell you that the car has plenty of torque/power and real moves. I'll have to further analyze it once I get my pulley for a 65 Tbird andinstall it on the 60 TBIRD.

Take care!

[KULTULZ]

It Has Been Updated

HBA-AH-1
II F
4M 18 B

This identifies the pump style (manufacturer) and the date code (4M 18) is 1964. It is also a FORD (THOMPSON) pump whereas an EATON was OEM on the 60 BIRD. C4AE on the pan rail identifies the engine block as being a 390 from 1964.

It appears what has happened here is that the previous owner just simply upgraded the engine instead of rebuilding the origional 352. He somehow got the FEAD (Front End Accessory Drive) mixed between the two. All of the mounting brackets and pullies should have stamping I.D. Nos. on them and you can determine what you have by finding those. You would then just use whatever year FEAD you desire (there may be an issue with the water pump also as they changed the snout length somewheres in that period-I believe it was with the introduction of the alternator which I think was available on the BIRD in 1964).

Now, I would be concerned as to how the intake manifold, cyl. heads and exhaust manifolds read in regards to casting I.D. Nos. as these will give the year of the engine away if you want to show it.

Hope this helps and good luck with it. Simply a case of the origional owner not paying attention to detail with the upgrade. It can be straightened out.

[Guest]

RE: It Has Been Updated

Well I thought I got the right pulley off a 66 tbird but the the junk yard sent me some other pump and pulley because the P/S shaft was much smaller in dia plus the pulley they sent (pressed onto the P/S) wobbled worst then mine so I didn't even bother to try to install it. I do know know it's a FORD (Thompson pump) and that helps. I'll check the numbers on the brackets & pulleys but how
can I decode them?????? Is there a place to check those codes???

Thanks,

Jack

[Guest]

RE: It Has Been Updated

Sorry to reply again but the number on the P/S pulley is AF. What does that mean??

Thanks in advance

[KULTULZ]

Parts I.D.

Sorry. I haven't been here in a few days.

http://www.gearheadracing.com/Reference/Ford/CastingNumbers/FordCastingNumbers.htm

While not all of what is described on the above site is accurate, it will get you into the ballpark.

The AF (on WP drive pulley) has no meaning to us (unless it was released in a TSB). Usually there will be a stamping I.D. No. that will give you at the least the year origin of the part. And remember, there are different drive pullies by year, gen.or alt. and A/C).

Did I mention the year of the water pump used may have some bearing on the FEAD? The 58/60 had one style and then was upgraded for 61/64. It was then again redesigned for 1965 to accept an alternator mounting. So you may have to decide as to whether what FEAD system to use by the water pump used (most likely 61/64 on yours). Is there any casting I.D. on the water pump?

[KULTULZ]

RE: It Has Been Updated

>Sorry to reply again but the number on the P/S pulley is AF.
> What does that mean??
>
>Thanks in advance

Why are you sorry? That's what this board is here for, to help. Ask all you need. Someone will have the correct answer(s).