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**simplyconnected** · August 30, 2013, 12:54 AM

Justin, do you have stones in your tires?

A clicking sound could be anything, including keys tapping against the dash, so give us a lot more information.

Is it coming from wheels? From under the hood? Under the car?

If you roll the car and shut the engine off while rolling, does the sound sustain? C'mon, give us more. - Dave

**scumdog** · August 30, 2013, 01:03 AM

Flogged-out universal???

**Justinryanh** · August 30, 2013, 09:37 AM

Originally posted by simplyconnected

Justin, do you have stones in your tires?

A clicking sound could be anything, including keys tapping against the dash, so give us a lot more information.

Is it coming from wheels? From under the hood? Under the car?

If you roll the car and shut the engine off while rolling, does the sound sustain? C'mon, give us more. - Dave

Fair enough Dave! It appears to be localized in the front center of the car and is louder from the bottom. It sounds like metal on metal, I was thinking possibly a loose/wobbly starter motor. Maybe a warped flywheel? When I disengage the flywheel I get a nice clean whirring sound when it try's to turn. There are two metal pipes that cross just under the transmission (I am not sure what those are), that appear to cause a slight clinking, but do not appear to be the primary cause as the sound is louder than just the clinking of those and sounds more mechanical in nature. The sound only happens a few seconds after start and during initial acceleration. Not sure if you have any ideas? Maybe I should post a video link? Does this forum allow that?

**jopizz** · August 30, 2013, 10:54 AM

My initial guess would be something related to the starter or flywheel as you mentioned. Possibly the starter gear is not disengaging all the way. Luckily those starters are much easier to come by and replace than the earlier ones. I would start there first.

John

**cdhowell** · August 30, 2013, 11:09 AM

Check motor mounts.

**Justinryanh** · August 30, 2013, 04:00 PM

Any ideas on how to check the flexplate/starter disengagement? what about motor mounts? Sorry, I am new to this, so much to learn!

**simplyconnected** · August 30, 2013, 07:17 PM

Originally posted by Justinryanh

...I was thinking possibly a loose/wobbly starter motor. Maybe a warped flywheel? When I disengage the flywheel I get a nice clean whirring sound when it try's to turn...

Did you get under the car and look around? I do that every time I change my oil and filter. Put your hands on different components and give them a shake.

I don't mean to be 'technical' but when you say you have a flywheel, that means your car is a stick. A warped flywheel usually chatters when you let the clutch pedal out.

Flywheels and flex plates both have a starter gear around the perimeter. You might be able to see the starter engage/disengage by removing the inspection plate on the bottom of the bell housing.

Originally posted by Justinryanh

...There are two metal pipes that cross just under the transmission (I am not sure what those are), that appear to cause a slight clinking, but do not appear to be the primary cause as the sound is louder than just the clinking of those and sounds more mechanical in nature. The sound only happens a few seconds after start and during initial acceleration...

Ok, now we're getting somewhere. At first I suspected a faulty throwout bearing. Then I questioned whether you even have a stick shift.

Now, I believe you have an exhaust leak. It could be leaking around an exhaust manifold, heat riser valve or at an exhaust coupling.

All components under and in your car are secured. If you have pipes 'floating around', strap them down. You need 'hands-on' troubleshooting from under the car while the engine is running. I would put the car in the air, on jack stands, with the rear wheels off the ground to eliminate any possibility of mistakes. - Dave

**Justinryanh** · August 30, 2013, 07:29 PM

Originally posted by simplyconnected

Did you get under the car and look around? I do that every time I change my oil and filter. Put your hands on different components and give them a shake.

I don't mean to be 'technical' but when you say you have a flywheel, that means your car is a stick. A warped flywheel usually chatters when you let the clutch pedal out.

Flywheels and flex plates both have a starter gear around the perimeter. You might be able to see the starter engage/disengage by removing the inspection plate on the bottom of the bell housing.

Ok, now we're getting somewhere. At first I suspected a faulty throwout bearing. Then I questioned whether you even have a stick shift.

Now, I believe you have an exhaust leak. It could be leaking around an exhaust manifold, heat riser valve or at an exhaust coupling.

All components under and in your car are secured. If you have pipes 'floating around', strap them down. You need 'hands-on' troubleshooting from under the car while the engine is running. I would put the car in the air, on jack stands, with the rear wheels off the ground to eliminate any possibility of mistakes. - Dave

Awesome. Making progress! Today's lesson for me on google was flywheel vs flex plate. I definetly have a flex plate/automatic. I will give the car a "shakedown" tonight to ensure I am not missing something dumb. One piece I forgot to mention that works nicely with your feedback is that I DO have an exhaust leak, found it last night. I forgot to mention that in the last post. It is right at the exhaust manifold and it is rather large. It appears that the PO tried to correct it with a series of washers. This is on the passenger side of the car. From what I gathered last night there should be some kind of "sensor" there that assists the car starting in cold weather. Since I am in az, I believe that there is an aftermarket spacer that I should be able to incorporate, any of this sounding right?

**jopizz** · August 30, 2013, 08:09 PM

What you are describing is called a heat riser valve. They are notorious for leaking when they get worn. They can also get worn to the point of making a noise when you accelerate similar to what you are describing. And yes there is a plain spacer available. Any of the Thunderbird vendors should carry them.

John

**Justinryanh** · August 30, 2013, 08:16 PM

Yeah my heat riser appears to be missing. So the leak is severe, and hence the many washers to try and bridge the gap and pull the exhaust pipe into the manifold... Lol. I guess we will see how this goes

I will post an update. I am assuming that will fix a lot of my issue

**simplyconnected** · August 30, 2013, 09:04 PM

Originally posted by Justinryanh

...One piece I forgot to mention that works nicely with your feedback is that I DO have an exhaust leak, found it last night. I forgot to mention that in the last post...

I'm very glad you are now on the right track toward fixing your problem.

Allow me to rant for a minute... I know nothing about your car but I do know how it should be. Internet boards like this one absolutely depend on each detail of your description. Only then can you expect an educated guess. I got to your solution by reading one phrase, then between the lines, as you mentioned nothing regarding your exhaust.

So this goes for everyone looking for suggestions: Do not write one sentence about your problem. Instead, give us a few descriptions or explain it different ways. This really helps us to help you. I do not believe in buying unneeded parts, then ending up with a basket full of expensive but good parts that you can't use. A better alternative is to prove your parts to be bad, then only replace those. - Dave

**Justinryanh** · August 30, 2013, 10:17 PM

Would the heat riser cause the metal on metal sound at start as well as acceleration? I just ordered the part from macs but want to make sure I am getting all the bases covered

**Justinryanh** · August 30, 2013, 11:17 PM

Dave, a couple comments on your rant if you don't mind...

First off, your responses intimidate me a little as someone just getting started out. I have a mechanical mind, but not one that has been applied to automotive for a great many years. So while I assume that you want to continue and encourage participation, my lack of knowledge makes me somewhat hesitant to post a new thread.

Second, with that being said, I want you to know that if you fix the problem, regardless of my lack on competence, I am impressed and will continue to post.... Regardless of my reluctance or ignorance

**jopizz** · August 30, 2013, 11:45 PM

Justin,

Please don't get intimidated by the responses you may get. Everyone is here to help. It's just that everyone has their own level of expertise and Dave is at the highest level. It may sound like he's trying to discourage you but he's really just trying to get you to explain the problem and the symptoms fully the first time so that he doesn't waste both his time and yours leading you in the wrong direction.

As far as the noise you are hearing the only way to work on cars is to fix the problems you know first. Since you know that the heat riser valve or lack of it is a problem then that needs to be fixed first. If that gets rid of the noise great, if not then it's time to look in another area. At least with the exhaust fixed it's much easier to hear and diagnose where the noise might be coming from.

John

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