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  • #31
    Update:

    Picked up car this morning. Drove it to where I'm storing it near where I work. It was doing fine for about 30 minutes but then I hit stop and go traffic and it started acting funny. Sidenote - it broke down last time during stop and go traffic. When I came to a stop the oil light flickered on red and stayed lit until I gave it a little gas to get moving. Once I touched the gas the light went off. It continued to do this all the way to my destination. I thought it would break down but it made it.

    But when I went to back into my space the car died. I had to push it into the spot. The car would not start again. It tries to start but won't. I'm really frustrated and not sure what to do. I'm going to give it time and try to start it later or tomorrow. I may try to jump start it to see if that works. It's annoying since I just spent a lot of money towing and at the shop it can't even make one drive without breaking down.

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    • #32
      Call the shop that did the repairs and tell them that it broke down and you want THEM to pay to have it towed back to their shop. Don't take no for an answer. It sounds like you either have a fuel/carburetor issue when it gets hot or an ignition issue. All reputable shops give a warranty on any repairs that they do.

      John
      John Pizzi - Squarebirds Administrator

      Thunderbird Registry #36223
      jopizz@verizon.net 856-779-9695

      http://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm

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      • #33
        Thanks. I know they have their own tow truck too.

        A friend of mine is suggesting that maybe it needs an oil change or is low on oil. The mechanic checked the oil and said it looked clean and he didn't think it was necessary to do an oil change. So I don't know if that has anything to do with this.

        I will call shop and see if they will be willing to help.

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        • #34
          It has nothing to do with the oil. The oil light will flicker when it's close to stalling out. The engine isn't running fast enough to generate enough oil pressure to turn the light off.

          John
          Last edited by jopizz; August 1st, 2018, 10:32 AM.
          John Pizzi - Squarebirds Administrator

          Thunderbird Registry #36223
          jopizz@verizon.net 856-779-9695

          http://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm

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          • #35
            Labor $200
            Parts $118

            (PARTS)
            Starter Cable - $25
            Starter Solinoid (Ford Motorcraft) - $60
            Points - $19
            Condencer - $15 (what's a condencer?)

            (LABOR)
            Replace points, condencer, and set timing, fix carb - $100
            Install starter cable and solinoid, charge battery - $100

            I suppose this is $100/hr labor with 2 hours work


            Originally posted by jopizz View Post
            Let us know what it says. I'd be interested in the ratio between parts and labor.

            John

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            • #36
              The condenser is inside the distributor. Normally points and condenser are changed at the same time. Since they didn't specify the hours it's just a guess how long it took or what their hourly rate is. It looks like they used high quality parts at any rate.

              John
              John Pizzi - Squarebirds Administrator

              Thunderbird Registry #36223
              jopizz@verizon.net 856-779-9695

              http://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm

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              • #37
                I agree with John but the shop might say they had it fixed and now it's a new issue....

                Guess you could always ask how long they tested it before they called it fixed.

                Does sound like the classic fuel system problem. The old fuel pump seals just can't handle the newer ethanol fuels and crack. I've had lots of trouble with them - replaced about 5-6 in the last 10 years - basically ever other year although I did have one that only lasted a week. Also if the gas tank hasn't been replaced it can clog and not allow fuel to flow.

                If you don't want to try you could have the shop install a clear filter between the line going to the fuel tank and the fuel pump. If the car quits you can look at the filter and see if it has fuel. If not - the fuel pump isn't working or the tank line is clogged. Don't waste any money on having the tank cleaned - I tried that and wound up with another tow bill - just have it replaced.

                http://www.squarebirds.org/picture_g...eplacement.htm

                Here's a pic of my clear fuel filter installed between the fuel pump and line to the tank (the power steering hose is blocking part of the filter)


                If you still have the original Ford Autolite 4100 carburator you may want to get the shop to also flush out the fuel filter. The filters are no longer available but turn up on flea-bay often. They can be flushed out fairly well with a can of carb cleaner assuming they are the old screen type like original (with no paper in them).



                Here's where the fuel filter sccrews into the original style carb.


                I've had a coil that gave that same symptom too - once hot the car would start missing and barely run - eventually quitting all together. After it cooled off it ran again for a while until the coil heated up again.

                Yikes - I know cost of living is higher in NY but a Motorcraft starter solenoid is $35 at Oriley's and the points and condenser should be about $10 each. Condenser is part of the ignition system - what makes the spark.....


                Don't give up - hope you get it fixed and can enjoy a nice drive.

                Eric

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                • #38
                  Kirsten has a '59 Thunderbird. That year did not have the screw in filter on the carburetor.

                  John
                  John Pizzi - Squarebirds Administrator

                  Thunderbird Registry #36223
                  jopizz@verizon.net 856-779-9695

                  http://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm

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                  • #39
                    Ooops

                    Thought I remembered the screw in was standard on the 4100 from 58-60 and a different screw in type on the 430.

                    Gettin' old -

                    So guess it's the glass bowl on the fuel pump (if the fuel pump is original)?

                    Which means strike the glass filter since you already have one.

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                    • #40
                      Thanks All for the suggestions. Mechanic (Bob) says he fixed the issues that he found but this must be something else that wasn't discovered the first time around.

                      Luckily, he has offered to come tow the car back to his shop (it's about an hour away from where I broke down) free of charge. Very nice of him. I do not plan on taking the car this far again in the near future. Just local driving for me until I discover all the kinks in this thing. That way, if it dies again I won't be so far from home and the shop.

                      He suggested perhaps there is fuel in the oil or it could be the ignition - it could be anything really so once he takes a look will hopefully find the issue and it won't be something major. Said the oil looked ok but maybe it needs to be a thicker oil. He spouted off a number of possiblities.

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                      • #41
                        There are a lot of good suggestions here to a lot of 'what if' questions. Bottom line is, whenever your car (engine) stops running we need to know WHY.

                        A 'dead engine' simply requires good troubleshooting techniques in three basic areas. Fire requires FUEL, AIR AND HEAT. Your engine is no different. I treat every failure like it never happened before and I don't listen to suggestions like, 'last time it was...'

                        Removing the air cleaner guarantees free air flow and it reveals carburetor operation. If pumping the accelerator squirts gas into the carb, that's a good thing. Does it SMELL like gas or not? If I don't smell gasoline, I pour a little fresh gas down the carb, then try starting it. If the engine starts then dies, it's a fuel or fuel delivery problem.

                        If the engine doesn't start with gas, spark comes next because the arc is easy to see and hear.

                        It's important to troubleshoot as soon as the problem arises because all the conditions change later, when the engine and electrical components cool and fuel pressure relaxes in the system. Troubleshooting requires positive interaction of your senses but also detection of their absence, like if you don't smell gas after cranking. That's the time to pour a little gas or spray a little starting fluid down the carb., then try it again.

                        Electrical failures scare many troubleshooters. There are only a few basic components in the entire electrical system (coil, points, wires and plugs). I start with plugs and work my way back to the points and coil. - Dave
                        My latest project:
                        CLICK HERE to see my custom hydraulic roller 390 FE build.

                        "We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?"
                        --Lee Iacocca

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by ssj335 View Post
                          Mechanic (Bob) says he fixed the issues that he found but this must be something else that wasn't discovered the first time around.
                          That's why it's imperative for a mechanic to take the car for an extended test drive after working on it. That way it would've broken down while he was driving it instead of you. It's a shame that what used to be a common practice years ago is no longer seen as important.

                          John
                          John Pizzi - Squarebirds Administrator

                          Thunderbird Registry #36223
                          jopizz@verizon.net 856-779-9695

                          http://www.squarebirds.org/picture_gallery/TechnicalResourceLibrary/trl.htm

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by ssj335 View Post
                            Thanks All for the suggestions. Mechanic (Bob) says he fixed the issues that he found but this must be something else that wasn't discovered the first time around.

                            Luckily, he has offered to come tow the car back to his shop (it's about an hour away from where I broke down) free of charge. Very nice of him. I do not plan on taking the car this far again in the near future. Just local driving for me until I discover all the kinks in this thing. That way, if it dies again I won't be so far from home and the shop.

                            He suggested perhaps there is fuel in the oil or it could be the ignition - it could be anything really so once he takes a look will hopefully find the issue and it won't be something major. Said the oil looked ok but maybe it needs to be a thicker oil. He spouted off a number of possiblities.
                            You will receive all sorts of suggestions. All of them will be over a hundred dollars a pop.

                            The oil light flickers at a stop light because of the low idle speed of the engine. You could raise the idle speed slightly but you do not want to slam the transmission into the gears when you shift.

                            This whole thing could be the engine stalled, ok, it happens. You tried to restart and pressing the accelerator pedal flooded the warmed up engine. Possibly using this method several times over to restart the engine.
                            Austin

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                            • #44
                              Thanks guys. That is some real good advice. I bet this wouldn't have come up during a test drive because it didn't begin to happen until 30 minutes into the drive. I would love it if mechanics still did that though.

                              Hopefully will something as simple as a spark plug!

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                              • #45
                                P.S. wish I lived closer to you guys

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