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View Full Version : So, I've been quietly working on my 58


RustyNCa
02-16-2017, 04:38 PM
I'm aware a lot of you on here won't like my progress, but here she is...

I'm hopeful with my schedule, I fire her up next month or so to see what it sounds like.

She also got a bit of work on her nose.

Cheers
RustyNCA

Click on small pix for larger view.
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m125/justacog/58TBird/th_20170106_113233_1483735449273_zps5tak7emt.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/justacog/media/58TBird/20170106_113233_1483735449273_zps5tak7emt.jpg.html )http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m125/justacog/58TBird/th_20170127_182958_zps1doutoyq.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/justacog/media/58TBird/20170127_182958_zps1doutoyq.jpg.html)http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m125/justacog/58TBird/th_20170127_183024_zpsbuekl0qt.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/justacog/media/58TBird/20170127_183024_zpsbuekl0qt.jpg.html)

simplyconnected
02-16-2017, 05:05 PM
Well, I don't know about anyone else but I love your setup. Is that a GM blower? Are you using forged pistons? C'mon, give us the skinny, like C.I., heads, compression ratios, cam duration, etc. You can expect ~40% more ponies over stock depending on your blower's %. It sure beats centrifugal setups and the chrome is beautiful.

What trans? RE? Tires?
I want a ride! - Dave

DKheld
02-16-2017, 05:20 PM
Now that's going to put some "Thunder" in Thunderbird.

You are definitely going to have to do a youtube video so we can see AND hear.

Wowzers!

We need to get you and Greg on a drag strip. :D

NICE!!!

RustyNCa
02-16-2017, 05:24 PM
Well, I don't know about anyone else but I love your setup. Is that a GM blower? Are you using forged pistons? C'mon, give us the skinny, like C.I., heads, compression ratios, cam duration, etc. You can expect ~40% more ponies over stock depending on your blower's %. It sure beats centrifugal setups and the chrome is beautiful.

What trans? RE? Tires?
I want a ride! - Dave

Yes, it's a Hampton 671 blower based of the GM model. We set it on a Blue Thunder Intake with a 2.5" riser to clear the distributor. We are running dual Holley 4150 650s with manual sec and no chokes.

Motor is a 390 with factory 390GT heads we think. Compression is 9:1 or so, blower should run about 7 to 8 lbs boost the way I have it setup right now.

Cam is a 236/236 572/572 108 103

Tran is a C6 with a 9" out back(right now stock stall, which I'm sure will not stay in there). I haven't done anything with the rear end yet. She will need some changing when I get there.

Rear tires are 275x45x17s, not really a drag setup at this point. Same tires I have on the rear of the olds also sitting in the one photo.

I still have to finish the throttle linkage, fuel lines and get the correct belt, I ended up with one about 6" to long, and run the coolant lines. Click on small pic for bigger view.
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m125/justacog/58TBird/th_20170127_183101_zpsshx0poug.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/justacog/media/58TBird/20170127_183101_zpsshx0poug.jpg.html)

simplyconnected
02-16-2017, 06:23 PM
...Tran is a C6 with a 9" out back(right now stock stall, which I'm sure will not stay in there). I haven't done anything with the rear end yet. She will need some changing when I get there...Are you keeping the coil spring setup for the RE? (I hope you go with leafs on the same axle.)

Yeah, you need a stall converter. With your cam, driving is a fight w/OEM. Also consider a lower RE gear, just to keep the RE from breaking.

Are your pistons forged? This is important when using a blower.
Love, love, love your setup so far. - Dave

RustyNCa
02-16-2017, 06:37 PM
Are you keeping the coil spring setup for the RE? (I hope you go with leafs on the same axle.)

Yeah, you need a stall converter. With your cam, driving is a fight w/OEM. Also consider a lower RE gear, just to keep the RE from breaking.

Are your pistons forged? This is important when using a blower.
Love, love, love your setup so far. - Dave

Yeah, the 390 is just getting me out the door. Think of it this way, I had the blower and wanted to get it running and installed. Then we will build a real blower motor for it. We have another motor, a Mercury 410 with low miles we are thinking of building and going forged with alum heads all that on it. Same with the rear end, it won't stay the stock 3.0 open. I've never owned a blower motor vehicle yet, so I'm excited about the learning I've been doing.

We are thinking on the rear, we will either go with a four link, or even a HotRod's to Hell setup. I do have a full Cobra cradle, but I haven't figured yet if it's width is okay, since I would like to narrow the rear end up from what it is. And the Cobra also does seem to fight wheel hop from what I've read? And if all the work that would require is even worth the effort...

simplyconnected
02-16-2017, 06:49 PM
I love the Cobra cradle. It's so convenient and easy to adapt.

The 390 is a great engine. It shares the same crank as an FE 427. I know some folks used a 410 crank in the 390 but not sure if the Mercury is the same. If you can't tell, I prefer the 390 because it's commonly available everywhere and so much can be done to it because of aftermarket support.

My next choice is the 351W-based 427 (Coyote) engine. 351Windsors are everywhere because they are SBF. Ford put them in Mustang Cobra, F-150 Harley trucks, Lightning trucks and a host of full size cars. Great engine, great support and many come with roller cams and EFI. - Dave

RustyNCa
02-16-2017, 06:59 PM
I love the Cobra cradle. It's so convenient and easy to adapt.

The 390 is a great engine. It shares the same crank as an FE 427. I know some folks used a 410 crank in the 390 but not sure if the Mercury is the same. If you can't tell, I prefer the 390 because it's commonly available everywhere and so much can be done to it because of aftermarket support.

My next choice is the 351W-based 427 (Coyote) engine. 351Windsors are everywhere because they are SBF. Ford put them in Mustang Cobra, F-150 Harley trucks, Lightning trucks and a host of full size cars. Great engine, great support and many come with roller cams and EFI. - Dave

What I was told is the 410, is basically the 390 with the 428 crank? At least that is what a friend of mine told me, well the guy that gave me the motor.

The Cobra rear end I have seems perfect. LSD with 3.73 gears and the axle shafts are massive. Has a nice stout sway bar. I'd just need to fab up a way to mount the cradle under the car. My one worry is the width, I haven't sat and looked hard at it yet.

I actually picked it and two Lincoln 8.8 cradles from a client when they were available. Reason I grabbed them was for our CTS-V, but then I read what the balance of that conversion was costing and kinda halted it.

He had a 56 TBird with a supercharged Coyote and the Cobra 8.8 out back, and the cradles I grabbed were "extra"

simplyconnected
02-17-2017, 12:28 AM
...The Cobra rear end I have seems perfect. LSD with 3.73 gears and the axle shafts are massive. Has a nice stout sway bar. I'd just need to fab up a way to mount the cradle under the car. My one worry is the width, I haven't sat and looked hard at it yet.

I actually picked it and two Lincoln 8.8 cradles from a client when they were available. Reason I grabbed them was for our CTS-V, but then I read what the balance of that conversion was costing and kinda halted it.

He had a 56 TBird with a supercharged Coyote and the Cobra 8.8 out back, and the cradles I grabbed were "extra"The width of the 8.8 isn't much different from the 9". Mustang GTs used straight 8.8 axles. Cobras are the exact same body with a cradle bolted on instead of the straight axle. The big difference is, independent suspension.

Your 9" is actually stronger than the 8.8 and I don't know if I would trust the independent axles with that much HP. All you need is a pair of leaf springs and four perches from a '59 or '60, bolted to your 9" axle.

3.77 may be ok for your C-6 but you're crankin' over 500HP. I wouldn't go any taller than 3.90:1. I ran a 4.30 posi in my Mustang for many years but it was fed with an AOD. The C-6 is stronger than an AOD but you're limited to three gears.

Here's something that will help you... The sun gear from an E4OD will fit your C-6. First gear will be ~20% lower, second will be ~15% lower and third is stock (straight through). I did this on my C-6 and it really helps a tall RE gear. You still need a stall converter. Any good gear and axle shop should have parts, or know where to get them.

Now you have to make some choices... - Dave

DKheld
02-17-2017, 08:17 AM
Bryan - you might want to send a PM to Tom Wollenburg (Tom's bird) here on the forum. He is currently installing leaf springs on his '58 and replacing the springs (along with rear discs and some other upgrades). Guess that could help with the decision.
Tom's a super nice guy - I'm sure he can give you some details on what was needed.

Eric

OX1
02-17-2017, 08:48 AM
Whats the plan for the hood? Pins?

Otherwise love it and do agree that you should leave the 9".

I'm aware a lot of you on here won't like my progress, but here she is...

I'm hopeful with my schedule, I fire her up next month or so to see what it sounds like.

She also got a bit of work on her nose.

Cheers
RustyNCA

Click on small pix for larger view.
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m125/justacog/58TBird/th_20170106_113233_1483735449273_zps5tak7emt.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/justacog/media/58TBird/20170106_113233_1483735449273_zps5tak7emt.jpg.html )http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m125/justacog/58TBird/th_20170127_182958_zps1doutoyq.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/justacog/media/58TBird/20170127_182958_zps1doutoyq.jpg.html)http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m125/justacog/58TBird/th_20170127_183024_zpsbuekl0qt.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/justacog/media/58TBird/20170127_183024_zpsbuekl0qt.jpg.html)

RustyNCa
02-17-2017, 12:50 PM
Whats the plan for the hood? Pins?

Otherwise love it and do agree that you should leave the 9".

I have a spare hood that I am hoping I can cut such that it can still hinge down over the entire thing.

To be honest, I have not been worrying bout that stage of the build till I get there.

I've been trying to do this without making un-reversible? changes to the car, so far I have accomplished that. Right now I can still pull this mess out and stuff the original drive train I kept back in, if I was so inclined anyway.

RustyNCa
02-17-2017, 12:52 PM
Bryan - you might want to send a PM to Tom Wollenburg (Tom's bird) here on the forum. He is currently installing leaf springs on his '58 and replacing the springs (along with rear discs and some other upgrades). Guess that could help with the decision.
Tom's a super nice guy - I'm sure he can give you some details on what was needed.

Eric

That would be interesting, then I could run that rear sway bar I tried that would only work on a leaf spring rear end.

On my list is doing rear discs, the drums just get in the way.

RustyNCa
02-17-2017, 12:55 PM
The width of the 8.8 isn't much different from the 9". Mustang GTs used straight 8.8 axles. Cobras are the exact same body with a cradle bolted on instead of the straight axle. The big difference is, independent suspension.

Your 9" is actually stronger than the 8.8 and I don't know if I would trust the independent axles with that much HP. All you need is a pair of leaf springs and four perches from a '59 or '60, bolted to your 9" axle.

3.77 may be ok for your C-6 but you're crankin' over 500HP. I wouldn't go any taller than 3.90:1. I ran a 4.30 posi in my Mustang for many years but it was fed with an AOD. The C-6 is stronger than an AOD but you're limited to three gears.

Here's something that will help you... The sun gear from an E4OD will fit your C-6. First gear will be ~20% lower, second will be ~15% lower and third is stock (straight through). I did this on my C-6 and it really helps a tall RE gear. You still need a stall converter. Any good gear and axle shop should have parts, or know where to get them.

Now you have to make some choices... - Dave

Thanks for the info Dave. I know some of the V guys are running over 800 to 1,100 HP through their 8.8s, but they are running custom axles built for the power. Hard to imagine those 4 door Cadillacs out there with 800 plus eh?

Dakota Boy
02-17-2017, 01:47 PM
NICE! Curious to see what you do with the hood. I am also going to have to modify mine at some point.


mattyel is going to have a blown 460 in his car. I've seen some pics on facebook. (he lives in Australia)

Tom's bird
05-07-2017, 09:21 AM
It's been a while but been busy. I've made quite a few changes to the 58, First I'll blame it on Eric for showing me his bird. Working with a shop here in NC. I decided to put in leaf springs. It was decided to make the springs run straight vs. at an angle like the 59 & 60. 9 in rear with 3:70 gears. Well, that moved the rear sliding shackles to the fuel tank area. Now gotta fix that with a new tank/location.

Next we found major rust in the rocker area as well as the front structure. Basically installed a frame to tie front and rear sub-frames together. Added rear disk brakes and went with new master cylinder. new 17 in wheels and tires
(Got a set of 15" wire wheels in good shape if someone needs them) Installed new Borgenson power steering box with Ididit column.

Now on to the engine I took the 390 (which the last builder put the head gaskets on backwards, which caused major damage to the rear cylinder valves with overheat) after all the work we stroked it, added Elderbrock Performer aluminum heads and intake. Running a Fi-Tech Fuel injection, Ended up with a 445 cu in stroker producing 525 HP and 595 lbs of torque. And then committed sacrilege, I installed a GM 700R w/OD.

Will be doing new speedhut gauges and all new wiring. Bottom line a lot of work to go. That's why they call it a hobby, it never ends, but we say we enjoy it.