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Dan.loeb
09-29-2014, 11:42 PM
Hey guys,

I am going to do a gen to alt conversion but can not seem to find a model type of alternator to get. I am looking at getting a high amp output 3 wire. I will be using an electric fan and the normal stock electronics. Is there a model alternator I can pick up at a local parts store to do the conversion?

I did check the trl but I did not see a model listed. I believe I read a Mustang fox body alt would work.

simplyconnected
09-30-2014, 01:51 AM
A Mustang Fox body alternator will NOT work. My 1990 came with a mechanical fan and a 70-amp alternator. That's not enough power for an electric fan. You need over 100 amps. (Ask me how I know.) 1995 T-birds had a 110-amp alt. that will work.

Go to a bone yard and get the electric fan AND alt from a Ford car or truck. If the car came with an electric fan, you KNOW the alt is big enough. If you're worried about high mileage, a brush holder set costs under $15.00 new.

Look for a full-size Ford, Mercury or Lincoln. Try to get one with a 351W engine because that setup favors your FE motor more closely than a SN95 setup. They normally clip the wires, so you get the plugs. If you don't get plugs they are for sale at the parts stores.

I run my Y-Block all day in parade traffic. The electric fan straightens out 'cooling at idle speeds' and the alt keeps my battery charged. The Fox Mustang alt will drain your battery, which is ok if you don't stall and you can get out into flowing traffic to cool your system and build your battery back up. See, the problem is, with a 75-amp, there isn't enough idle-speed amps but there is with a larger alt.

Dakota Boy
09-30-2014, 08:54 AM
late '90's Ford Contour dual electric fan will fit the stock radiator nicely; and can be bought new from rock auto for around $100

Dan.loeb
09-30-2014, 01:46 PM
Simply, any suggested model ford cars to ask autozone for to get an alternator?

jopizz
09-30-2014, 02:50 PM
How are you going to mount it? If your block is drilled for an alternator you can use a Ford 1G style alternator if you get the correct factory style bracket for the water pump. Many '62 blocks were drilled for an alternator even if they came with a generator. If you don't have the hole drilled you will have to use an aftermarket bracket setup. If you are going to do that you can use a GM 3 wire alternator which is much easier to wire in my opinion.

John

simplyconnected
10-01-2014, 03:02 AM
What's the difference, John? GM and Ford are both 3-wire (with one wire going to ground). Whichever one he gets, and I really don't have a preference, he will fabricate brackets for.

Another consideration is the pulley. Dan will need to swap pulleys from the setup he has or get another for the new alternator.

Brackets are not that hard to do. If you look at brackets offered, most are nipples cut from 1/2" (trade size schedule-40) pipe for spacers, long bolts and heim rods (available cheap from speedwaymotors.com, like this one for five bucks:

http://static.speedwaymotors.com/RS/SR/Product/22/175PMR6T.GS_L_1b90bc13.JPG (http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Garage-Sale-3-8-Inch-RH-Male-Heim,103437.html)

Click on the picture for the Speedway listing.

Mr. Dan, read my answer again for a model of car. - Dave

Dan.loeb
12-01-2014, 02:24 PM
http://www.ebay.com/itm/360654598757?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

It's a alternator for a 1994-1996 thunderbird and it's a 130 amp alternator with an internal regulator.

Also, any other ideas for a bracket other then the crap bracket? I do not have the additional hole on the block that the 1963 and ups have.

Will the pulley off of my generator fit on the shaft for this slternator

Is this alternator a 1 wire or 3 wire

YellowRose
12-01-2014, 04:37 PM
There is more than one 352/390 CRAP alternator mounting bracket. The one that has the special bracket to allow attaching the mounting bracket to a 352 block without the extra mounting hole that is in newer 352/390 blocks, is Stock #92264, according to the owner, Larry Gueths. This is a complete mounting kit and includes all the stainless steel mounting hardware necessary plus a special bracket that utilizes the original tapped hole on the side of the block that Ford used, to attach the original generator mounting bracket. For those who have the 352/390 blocks with the additionally drilled hole in the block, you can use Stock #92262 or 92263. If you have any questions, give Larry a call at 815-634-8216, as I just did. Or email him at LARRY@CARCRAP.NET

http://www-link.com/cgi-bin/odbic.exe/cybercity/scripts/catalog.html?groupname=ford%20parts%20&clientno=1681.0

I do not know if that alternator will work, or if it is 1 wire or 3 wire, but one of our guys can tell you when they come along and see this post.

simplyconnected
12-01-2014, 06:03 PM
...Will the pulley off of my generator fit on the shaft for this slternator

Is this alternator a 1 wire or 3 wire
This alternator is commonly known as a 6G and commonly used with electric fans. It is a three-wire: Your yellow/bk (GEN light) wire tells the alt that your key is turned on, the power wire goes to a fuse then to your battery, and the third wire is ground. The only other wires you need is the voltage regulator wire which is commonly available at just about all auto parts stores for two bucks (STANDARD MOTOR PRODUCTS Part #HP3880).

Normally, if you get a bone yard alt, they simply cut the wires and include all connectors with the alt.

You need a small 'collar' washer that goes behind your alternator's pulley, then it should work just fine. That washer is probably already on the alt if it comes with a pulley. BTW, Chevy generator pulleys work, too. If you only have one belt, use a larger diameter pulley or it will squeal a lot. Large diameter gives the belt more surface to grab and it's easier to turn (like a longer lever). That's why Ford went with double-sheave and serpentine pulleys.

The 6G is an excellent choice. - Dave

Dan.loeb
12-03-2014, 10:57 PM
Looking at craps alternator brackets would it be worth while buying the 89 dollar bracket and drill and helicoil a hole into the block to save the extra 50 dollars for the other 352 bracket for the side bracket?

I have a helicoil kit for a 3/8 bolt. Is there enough meat on the block in the spot where the bolt would need to go to drill into?

Joe Johnston
12-03-2014, 11:22 PM
I wouldn't do it. (drill the block)

simplyconnected
12-04-2014, 08:54 AM
Dan.loeb, I merged both your alternator threads because they pertain to the same thing.

Alternator mounting amounts to a 'tripod', with two brackets normally holding one end of the alt and the third one is your adjustment.

Sling the alt on the bottom, in place of your generator. That's where I put mine, and I used the same holes that the gen used. For the top adjustment, I used the water pump bolt. Yes, it is very long. So? It's a 5/16" which is plenty large enough to 'steady' the new alternator and tension the belt.

On another application (power steering pump), I made a 'C' bracket that encircled the pump. I bolted the mounting holes to my 'C' then I conveniently drilled holes in my bracket to more easily align with block holes. You can do the same with your alt.

Fabrication only takes a small bit of foresight, a tape measure, and basic steel. My hat goes off to Howard Prout. He fabricated a great firewall bracket for a Squarebird power brake vacuum booster. Once he got the design correct, he made two, had them both chrome plated and is using one. Ray Clark is using the other on his '59 SB. They have been in service for a few years, now.

We would all love to "buy one off the shelf" with the confidence that 'it' will fit. But our cars are fifty yrs-old and few are left. Demand is so low parts are hard to find or they were never made. That's why I bite the bullet and make my own.

My 6G is mounted on my Y-block. It is a three-wire alt and at idle, it puts out enough to run an electric fan in an all day parade as it also keeps my battery up. <--This is the real reason why you need such a huge alt. The supply must always exceed the demand.

Dan.loeb
12-04-2014, 06:58 PM
Simply, d you have any pics of your bracket you made?

simplyconnected
12-04-2014, 08:47 PM
...My 6G is mounted on my Y-block...

Simply, d you have any pics of your bracket you made?

I don't, but Charles does. Look at the simple but very effective brackets he made. First of all, he also has a Y-block. These are older engines that had less options than the FEs.

Check out the Sanden A/C compressor he mounted:
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a293/840-840-840/010_zps52ac3c16.jpg
If you follow his V-belt, it goes straight down to (you guessed it) an alternator.

The top front bracket is a simple 'tab' of steel mounted to the water pump. The top rear bracket is simply twisted with two holes, mounted on the timing cover. Can you buy them? I don't know why you'd want to. He used existing holes to his advantage and aligned them beautifully. - Dave

Dan.loeb
12-08-2014, 10:03 PM
Ok guys I finally got my 1996 thunderbird alternator 3 wire and have a question regarding the pulley.

The alternator currently has a serpentine pulley and I need to install a v belt pulley. I took the pulley off of the original genenerator but the pulley has an external fan on it. Do I need to purchase a new pulley or modify the stock one? If I need a new one where do I find one online.

simplyconnected
12-09-2014, 01:20 PM
You don't need the fan on your new alternator. You DO need a small spacer that keeps your generator pulley away from the alt housing (or it will rub). Alternators have internal fans. - Dave

Dan.loeb
12-15-2014, 11:21 PM
I went a head and ordered a dual pulley off of summit racing and it fit perfectly.

Here's my next question. I am almost finished with the wiring of the new alternator, but according to the wiring diagram on the trl is says I need to wire the thick yellow wire coming from the starter relay to the yellow wire coming off of the horn relay. It was originally connected to the voltage regulator I removed. It seems that my horn relay had two yellow wires coming off of the voltage regulator. Do I connect both yellow wires from the horn relay to the thick yellow wire from the starter relay

jopizz
12-16-2014, 12:26 AM
I'm not sure where you are seeing two yellow wires. You should have the thick yellow wire on the voltage regulator that goes to the starter solenoid connected to a thinner yellow wire going to the horn relay. The other two wires on the relay are blue-yellow to the horn button and black to the horns. When I went to an alternator I left the voltage regulator in place just for looks and gutted the inside. I left the wires connected the way they were on the voltage regulator.

John

YellowRose
12-16-2014, 12:42 AM
The same thing was done on my '59 when I converted to an alternator. The VR was left in place and just the wiring to the Gen light was used. Nothing else in the VR had to be used. I see that he removed his VR from the car.

simplyconnected
12-16-2014, 01:14 AM
The voltage regulator does nothing after you mount a self-regulating alternator, so you are certainly at liberty to remove it.

If you do, the Horn Relay needs power. You have two choices:
You can also remove the short yellow wire that formerly went to the regulator, then connect the #10 yellow wire that was on the regulator, and simply swing it over to the LH terminal of your horn relay OR,
You can remove the large (#10) yellow wire and simply run your own smaller (#14 or 16) wire from the Horn Relay's LH terminal to the Starter Solenoid, to pick up +12v.

That leaves only one wire remaining, a small GEN light wire (Yellow-Black). At this point it does nothing but it could be your new alternator's 'sense' wire, to tell the alternator that your Key Switch is turned on.

If you have a one-wire alternator, you're done. It cannot use the GEN wire so you might as well tape it off. Ray has a one-wire and he claims his GEN light works. If it is connected to the yellow +12 wire, that would make it NOT work because then the light would be connected at both ends to +12.

So, in a nutshell... remove the Voltage Regulator, remove both yellow wires, run a new wire from the Horn Relay's LH terminal to the Batt + (Starter Solenoid) and finally, use the small Gen (Yellow-Black) wire for your 'sense' on a 3-wire alt. - Dave