PDA

View Full Version : Edelbrock 1407


davidmij
06-04-2013, 09:34 PM
Hi, came across this carb for sale. It was only used for engine testing and has no mileage - it looks brand new.
I'm looking for any input on this carb as I know next to nothing about carbs. I eventually want to have a 390 or 428 with an edelbrock RPM performer intake and a mild to mid cam. Gas mileage (economy) is not an issue.

thx in advance, Dave J

KULTULZ
06-05-2013, 05:58 AM
EDELBROCK PERFORMER SERIES 750 CFM, MANUAL CHOKE CARBURETORS

CALIBRATED FOR PERFORMANCE

Designed and calibrated for optimum street performance in small-block and big-block engines with Performer RPM, RPM Air-Gap and Torker II manifolds and with Performer manifolds on large cubic-inch engines. Includes both timed and full vacuum ports for ignition advance. Electric choke #1478 can be added if needed. Comes with: Metering Jets - Primary .113, Secondary .107; Metering Rods - .071 x .047; Step-Up Spring - orange (5" Hg). Use our Carb Stud Kits #8008 or #8024 if needed, see Installation Items (http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_new/mc/install_items/general.shtml). For auto trans throttle lever adapters and more, see Tuning Accessories (http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_new/mc/carbs_acc/access_thun_perf.shtml).SOURCE- -EDELBROCK CARBURETORS- (http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_new/mc/carbs_acc/performer.shtml)

davidmij
06-05-2013, 09:51 AM
Thx Gary, I ws mostly wondering if someone might chime in with personal experience. Something like, "oh no, don't go edelbrock, it's crap compared to the Holley". etc.

This is the add and pictures I was looking at buying.
http://albuquerque.craigslist.org/pts/3849858981.html

If it's still available this Friday the guy said I could make him an offer - maybe get it for $150. Seems like a good deal. Plus, from what he tells me I can buy different jets from Edelbrock for $15 and go smaller if needed.

thx!

KULTULZ
06-05-2013, 10:22 AM
Thx Gary, I ws mostly wondering if someone might chime in with personal experience. Something like, "oh no, don't go edelbrock, it's crap compared to the Holley". etc.

Well, I am a HOLLEY/AUTOLITE 4100 man myself. The EDELBROCK is a continuation of the orgional CARTER carb. It is a quality product and is an easy bolt-on. Performance parts/upgrades are available directly from EDELBROCK and it is easily tunable. The last one I installed was on a 350 Stove Bolt... :( ... but it woke up the engine. They are also popular as replacements for original CARTER installs (LINC).

A 750 CFM is a little much for the street (IMO) but if the engine is modified to the point of accepting the flow, nothing wrong with it.

RustyNCa
06-05-2013, 01:15 PM
Thx Gary, I ws mostly wondering if someone might chime in with personal experience. Something like, "oh no, don't go edelbrock, it's crap compared to the Holley". etc.

This is the add and pictures I was looking at buying.
http://albuquerque.craigslist.org/pts/3849858981.html

If it's still available this Friday the guy said I could make him an offer - maybe get it for $150. Seems like a good deal. Plus, from what he tells me I can buy different jets from Edelbrock for $15 and go smaller if needed.

thx!

We have the 1406 on one of our 65 Tbirds and an older Carter on another one, both have been nice solid carburetors. They don't seem to create much drama and are easy to adjust and tune from my experience with them.

The 58 TBird is running a 390 with the Carter 650 on a performer intake with a mild cam, and it runs really nice.

Be careful about running to large a carburetor on your motor though, the 1407 might be to much for the 390? I know I ran one on our olds with a strong 455 and that motor did not like it in the turns. We finally landed with a Holley 650 jetted up to feed the 455 and the motor really likes the smaller carb.

jopizz
06-05-2013, 07:30 PM
The Edelbrock's are great carbs. However I agree that the 1407 might be too much for a 390. A 1406 would be a better fit. If it's cheap enough you can probably resell it, get a used 1406 and have money left over.

John

davidmij
06-05-2013, 09:13 PM
By 1406 do you mean a Holly?

Right now I have the original Autolite 1406. I like it and it's OK but I'm kind of planning down the road to have the 390 stroked , and/or build something bigger.

Being that you can downsize the jets on the Edelbrock I thought I could use it now and also later when I beef up the 390. Or is it a better idea to go with a smaller carb now, and a bigger one later?

Dave

triple60squares
06-05-2013, 11:37 PM
edelbrock is the only way to go I wouldn't run a holley on a lawn mower on the 390 the 750 will be fine be sure to keep your fuel pressure below 6 lbs if not you will blow fuel past the needle and seat I have 5 edelbrocks all are straight out of the box with only basic setup tuning done and have NO problems out of any of them

on the other hand I have never owned a good holley and ive had new, rebuilt, remaned, 600,650, 750,850,2bbls single lines, single pumpers, dual line double pumpers, center squirters, you name it all were garbage

ive had many carter/edelbrocks all were awesome except maybe one thermoquad

jopizz
06-06-2013, 12:43 AM
By 1406 do you mean a Holly?


I mean an Edelbrock 1406 600 cfm carburetor. That's the closest to the original Autolite 4100.

John

davidmij
06-06-2013, 09:13 AM
I guess I should have been more specific up front.

I have c4ae- 6090g heads. The have the large intake ports. I also have FPA headers and 2 1/2 pipes through straight glass packs. I plan having the heads rebuilt and a little porting and polishing done. I also plan on putting the carb on an Edelbrock RPM Performer intake. That should give me fairly decent flow.
If I understand correctly I can change the jets out fairly cheaply on the 1407 if it is too much for my set up.

Also, we are at 7,000 feet elevation. From what I've read that means I should adjust toward a more "richer" mix because we have less oxygen here.

I think I'll buy it and give it a try. I can always sell it if it's over kill.

My current autolite is a manual choke so that will be easy enough. I believe it is a vacuum secondary, I'll have to look.

Dave J

KULTULZ
06-06-2013, 10:06 AM
I guess I should have been more specific up front.

I have c4ae- 6090g heads. The have the large intake ports. I also have FPA headers and 2 1/2 pipes through straight glass packs. I plan having the heads rebuilt and a little porting and polishing done. I also plan on putting the carb on an Edelbrock RPM Performer intake. That should give me fairly decent flow.
If I understand correctly I can change the jets out fairly cheaply on the 1407 if it is too much for my set up.

Also, we are at 7,000 feet elevation. From what I've read that means I should adjust toward a more "richer" mix because we have less oxygen here.

I think I'll buy it and give it a try. I can always sell it if it's over kill.

My current autolite is a manual choke so that will be easy enough. I believe it is a vacuum secondary, I'll have to look.

Dave J

Again-



A 750 CFM is a little much for the street (IMO) but if the engine is modified to the point of accepting the flow, nothing wrong with it.

A lot depends on needed (or unneeded) CFM, degree of engine modifications, gearing and intended use.

For example, the 428CJ and SCJ came thru with a 735 HOLLEY. You may experience low end bogging, etc. but the carb and engine can be tuned to get beyond this. If you are not planning on a thumper but just a mild HP increase, the carb will flow too much.

EDELBROCK has an excellent modifications handbook.

scumdog
06-06-2013, 04:07 PM
davidmij: "Also, we are at 7,000 feet elevation. From what I've read that means I should adjust toward a more "richer" mix because we have less oxygen here."

As there is less oxygen you should be also having less fuel ("leaner") to keep things in balance?

As it is: an 'OK' fuel/air mixture at sea-level will become too rich when at 7000 feet.

Or have I got it wrong/?

simplyconnected
06-06-2013, 04:36 PM
That is correct, Tom. We are looking for 14.7:1 air-to-fuel ratio. If the air becomes thin, the gas (jets) must be reduced as well or the ratio will be out of whack. Rich mixture wastes gas and produces black smoke. - Dave

davidmij
06-06-2013, 09:56 PM
Thx Gents, yes, I got that totally backwards. No oxygen at high altitude would mean I need more oxygen.

I think I'll get it if he'll let it go for $150. I can always sell it and buy something else.

Really appreciate all the input everyone!

Dave J

davidmij
06-08-2013, 10:25 AM
So, I looked at crate engines on line. 390 short blocks, long blocks, talked to a couple of companies as well. I ended up on the phone with a very reputable machine shop named Anderson's in Albuquerque. I was talking with the owner Doug Anderson (very quiet, unassuming kind of a guy) who has been around for decades. He blew me away with his knowledge of FE engines. For instance when I told him I had c4ae-6090g heads he said that you can't put hardened valve seats in them, there isn't enough material on the head and you'll ruin the head. He said a lead additive will help if I'm worried about burning it up, but on a seasoned head like mine it shouldn't be a problem. He said he'd recommend just going to CJ valves and a matching cam - that will allow for good flow. He said he has some 428 cranks, use one of those will give me a 410 and increase the torque which is what you want on a heavy vehicle like a 59 T-bird. Depending on the shape of the motor maybe go .030 over and end up a little bigger. He said with that sort of set up I could use the Edelbrock 750, put in a number 12 something or other and be good at our altitude. (Albuq is a mile high). He's built engines for a couple of my friends here in Los Alamos and knows the adjustments for our altitude.

Here's a link I found with 2 builds that will most likely suit me??? http://www.network54.com/Forum/74182/message/1163471373/Two+combinations-+%28Edit%29
I think this is roughly what I want to do.

Off to a swap meet in Alb today.

thx, Dave

simplyconnected
06-08-2013, 02:34 PM
I take a more contemporary approach for the valve seat issue by using aluminum heads with hardened seats and stainless valves (bronze guides and Viton seals, as well) already in them. These are the materials you really want. And did I mention, modern engines have them as standard fare?

Both engines you cite have hardened exhaust seats installed (because they need them). The FE Forum has extensive discussion on this subject (CLICK HERE) (http://www.network54.com/Forum/74182/message/1229699164/If+done+correctly+---+installing+hardened+exhaust+seats+is+not+a+proble m) and I have pictures of 390 FE heads that clearly show the exhaust valves are dangerously recessed into the heads. I gladly gave the original iron heads to the sheeny man who was looking for scrap metal on garbage day. - Dave

KULTULZ
06-08-2013, 08:47 PM
...when I told him I had c4ae-6090g heads he said that you can't put hardened valve seats in them, there isn't enough material on the head and you'll ruin the head.

I would get a second opinion regarding the inserts...

Lead was used primarily as a very cheap way to raise octane, your health and the environment be ****ed. Valve damage was the last gasp of refiners trying to keep it. Probable valve recession is going to happen on a heavily loaded engine (truck). On a passenger car, not likely. That is why FT's employed sodium filled exhaust valves and valve rotators.

davidmij
06-09-2013, 11:25 AM
Hm, I'll go through the FE link sometime today Simplyconnected, thanks for pointing me to that. Reading all the stuff I can from guys who have real world experience helps me to understand.

He actually did recommend going with an intake and carb matched aluminum head from edelbrock, but I told him I didn't want to spent that much money on heads.
So do you guys think he is wrong that there isn't enough material for hardened seats on the c4ae's? I told him that I would be driving this car approximately 300 miles a year, and that it was just a fun, ratrod kind of a project. Maybe I gave him the vibe that I didn't care if it lasted.

I'll double check with him on the price of doing the existing heads with CJ valves versus buying aluminum Edelbrock FE's.

He said it's hard to give me a price as there's no telling what they'll run into when they get the motor apart. Could need tons of parts, could be that the existing stuff is OK. The heads were already rebuilt when I put them on a year ago. I've put (maybe) 150 miles on them, but I don't know if they had (viton?) seals, bronze guides or not. He said a rough estimate would be $2700 for a long block build - that was if I supplied the Edelbrock intake. I told him I'd probably go with a short block build because I liked working on it myself and could put the top end together. He said the price wouldn't be much different because bolting the top together isn't all that much work.

Do you guys know if I will have to go to a different oil pan to fit a 428 crank?

Thx Dave J

KULTULZ
06-09-2013, 04:44 PM
I'll double check with him on the price of doing the existing heads with CJ valves versus buying aluminum Edelbrock FE's.

Do you guys know if I will have to go to a different oil pan to fit a 428 crank?

Thx Dave J

The addition of larger valves is not going to get you much without porting and a decent set of headers.

You will use the OEM BIRD pan to clear the engine mounting crossover. If you decide to go with a low sump, you will either have to modify the pan or go with a MILODON custom pan. The aftermarket pan will have oil baffles and also consider using a windage tray.

The builder will need the CC's of the head combustion chambers to order the correct pistons for your desired final CR and you will have to verify valve to piston clearances if you assemble the short.

You need a basic education on engine building before you spend your money-

-HOW TO REBUILD FORD BIG BLOCK FE- (http://www.mre-books.com/engine/bigblock2.html)

davidmij
06-09-2013, 08:30 PM
I have the "How to build Max Performance Ford FE Engines" but I haven't gone through it since I swapped out the 352 for the 390. I also have FPA headers. I used the oil pan out of the 67 LTD 390. I had to dent it a little to get it to fit above the steering cylinder thing. Then the fin in the shallow end of the pan that touched the crank so I had to pull it out a tad - lot of fun that was!

Thx