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c4clewis
04-04-2011, 10:41 AM
I'm getting ready to get the car back from paint and have 2 questions (for now) for everyone.

1) Is it possible to get the engine and transmission installed as a unit? I pulled it out as one with the hood off, but also banged the firewall once or twice (oops!). Is it better/easier to install the engine then the trans?


2) What insurance do people have? I got an online quote from Hagarty and American Collectors Insurance. Hagerty was nearly half the price! Anyone have a reason to stay away from one company, or a compeling reason to pick 1 insurance over another?

Ca58tbird
04-04-2011, 11:54 AM
1) I had installed my engine and tranny as one unit carefully and slowly with some padding here and there and had no problems.

2) I have had my '58 Bird insured with JC Taylor Ins for 17 years. I also have on the policy my 1974 Yamaha 500 and my '48 Dodge PT Cruiser. The entire annual premium is $158. I have never had a claim.

60 T-Bird
04-04-2011, 03:03 PM
A definate yes. In the manual it recommends pulling the 430 engine with transmission which I did. I then rebuilt my transmission and bolted it to a 390 (same block as a 352) and installed them in 1 hour, There is a trick...turn the wheels to one side or the other as the power steering cylinder mount will touch the bell housing.

RustyNCa
04-04-2011, 03:10 PM
I'm getting ready to get the car back from paint and have 2 questions (for now) for everyone.

2) What insurance do people have? I got an online quote from Hagarty and American Collectors Insurance. Hagerty was nearly half the price! Anyone have a reason to stay away from one company, or a compeling reason to pick 1 insurance over another?

I had Hagerty till I learned from Hagerty that the way I use my cars was not really covered in the policy.

I tend to drive them to a parts store, hardware store, movie theater, etc. They told me, if the car was damaged or stolen while parked or used in that manner that there was no coverage....:eek:. They told me, the coverage only extends to use in, to or from an event, cruise or show....

So if the car was damaged or stolen I was out of luck. So I switched to Grundy, costs just a bit more, but it does have coverage for normal use as long as you don't use the car as a daily driver.

I don't treat my cars as garage/trailer queens so garage/trailer queen coverage is useless for me.

Cheers
RustyNCA

c4clewis
04-04-2011, 03:12 PM
That's what I'm talking about! I was thinking Hagerty until you posted that. I'm planning on driving mine as well. That's probably why they were so much cheaper than the other. I'll have to check out Grundy.

Anders
04-04-2011, 04:01 PM
There is a trick...turn the wheels to one side or the other as the power steering cylinder mount will touch the bell housing.

1) I had installed my engine and tranny as one unit carefully and slowly with some padding here and there and had no problems.


Great tips guys. I will install my Engine & Tranny on Saturday, and we will try it in one piece :)

partsetal
04-04-2011, 07:57 PM
Keep in mind that the engine and transmission together weigh just short of 1,000 lbs and you need good equipment to lift, tilt and maneuver it. If you're using a floor crane, take some measurements first to insure that your boom is extended far enough to clear the header sheetmetal, but not too far that it stresses the crane. A tilting hoist is necessary also. You can get even more room than turning the wheels by removing the three bolts that hold the idler arm to the right sub-frame, and dropping it almost to the ground. This way, the wheels can be straight and if you have to roll the car for or aft, it is much easier. Don't forget to install the starter.
Carl

gaffney1951
04-04-2011, 11:20 PM
of the car and putting it on jack stands will will help with the install. Get a floor jack on the trans tail and just slowly guide it in. we set ours in with the backhoe, and as you can see in the pic it's much easier with the front clip off.:) I've been happy with State Farm. I can set the value where I like (with in reason) and I'm gone in the winter and can put the cars to sleep and just have theft & fire when I leave for the winter. The rate's are very reasonable. I have 5000 mile IIRC limit on each car and four cars, so it works out fine that way. Also cheaper because I have my homeowners with the same company. Mike

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k134/gaffney1951/Galaxie/2006_0916Culabritta0104.jpg

60 T-Bird
04-05-2011, 12:49 AM
Keep in mind that the engine and transmission together weigh just short of 1,000 lbs and you need good equipment to lift, tilt and maneuver it. If you're using a floor crane, take some measurements first to insure that your boom is extended far enough to clear the header sheetmetal, but not too far that it stresses the crane. A tilting hoist is necessary also. You can get even more room than turning the wheels by removing the three bolts that hold the idler arm to the right sub-frame, and dropping it almost to the ground. This way, the wheels can be straight and if you have to roll the car for or aft, it is much easier. Don't forget to install the starter.
Carl

Thanx for that Carl...I should have mentioned I used an overhead chain hoist on a 4X6. Yes it is just over 1000lbs.

RustyNCa
04-05-2011, 02:02 PM
Do your self a favor and purchase one of these tools....

It is the only way to drop a motor back in.... to change the tilt of motor just use a wrench and you are at the angle you need....

http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m125/justacog/58TBird/P_00254.jpg

c4clewis
04-05-2011, 03:25 PM
Between jacking up the rear of the car, load leveler, and using my rolling dollies on the trans tail shaft, I think it will work out nicely.

Anyone have a reason not to go with Grundy insurance. They seem to look like a good deal and are 1/2 the price of going through USAA.:eek:

simplyconnected
04-05-2011, 03:54 PM
...purchase one of these tools...Man, that's all I use... and as the engine drops deeper, you can pull the center of gravity more towards the rear so the engine/trans levels out. It sure saves a lot of 'fighting' with the tailshaft and engine mounts.
http://home.comcast.net/~dldare/Mustang/DSCN9560b.jpg

Anders
04-05-2011, 05:17 PM
This is from when we took out the engine. My best buddies, from left, Karl-Johan Ekman, who owns a 27 original Tudor, a "new" Hemi 32 Deuce roadster, a 68 & 69 Camaro, Stefan Denzel, a stunning 65 Impala and Pontus Rosenqvist, 56 Hemi Chrysler.

Anders
04-09-2011, 01:56 PM
Put back the Engine & Tranny today. We where just two of us, and decided to connect the tranny to the engine, and put on the start motor, exhaust manifold and the lines to the tranny. The "only" worrying thing was the combined weight of course ( approx. 450 kg ). The more we needed to make the arm longer, the less weight it could carry. In the end, we needed to adjust the arm maximum, but settled for the one next to it, with the indication of 125 kg...
But we took it carefully and it was super smooth, and the whole package slided in like a charm :)
The last bit, we could not manage with the length we had, but I rolled in a jack underneath to support, and continued on "60 kg" to get that extra length but there was no problem at all. It took an hour.:cool: Im very happy we did it in one go, as it would be WAY harder to put everything back down there...
( By some reason, the pics came in the wrong order. Start from bottom )

gaffney1951
04-09-2011, 02:09 PM
smoothly. Mike

Richard D. Hord
04-09-2011, 02:23 PM
Hey Anders,
Great job! I hate to say this but I only see ONE guy working on installing the engine/tranny:eek: Where were you?
Richard D. Hord

Anders
04-09-2011, 02:30 PM
Hey Anders,
Great job! I hate to say this but I only see ONE guy working on installing the engine/tranny:eek: Where were you?
Richard D. Hord

Who do you think took the pictures?:p

Stephan was in command of the crane, and I hold the engine at the same time I was looking everywhere. Down, forward, angle, down, forward, oops, back, OK, angle, down, forward...and so on... ;)

simplyconnected
04-09-2011, 03:05 PM
That's how the engine and trans went in at the assembly plant... all in one piece. Any other way just means more work in a confined space.

Nice job, Anders. Is this a 'major overhaul'? I would like to hear what improvements you made before dropping the engine.

BTW, in the Repair Bay, two workers changed four engines per 8-hour shift.

EDIT: There is something wrong with the numbers on your hoist. There is no way the load capacity maximum is 132-pounds (60kg) fully extended. - Dave

Anders
04-09-2011, 03:12 PM
That's how the engine and trans went in at the assembly plant... all in one piece. Any other way just means more work in a confined space.

Nice job, Anders. Is this a 'major overhaul'? I would like to hear what improvements you made before dropping the engine.

BTW, in the Repair Bay, two workers changed four engines per 8-hour shift. - Dave

The engine was build like 5 years ago, but as the car dripped oil from the rear axle, tranny and "here & there" on the engine as well, I took all this out just to change a few seal and gaskets, and awerall clean it up. Another reason was also tolearn how to take these parts out, so I dont need to be nevous next time, when painting is on the agenda, in a few years. As it is a hobby car, I like to be able to know more. In the progress, Im now quite good at 58 rear suspesion :)

Anders
04-09-2011, 05:10 PM
I would like to move this thread to "FE ENGINES" (since it pertains to engines). Any objections?
No objection.

Anders, did you see my EDIT about your engine hoist?
Yes, now :)


EDIT: There is something wrong with the numbers on your hoist. There is no way the load capacity maximum is 132-pounds (60kg) fully extended. - Dave
This is how they look. I dont know. I guess there is a lot of safe tolerances build in. Thats what we thought as well, and lift the whole thing with the 125 kg mark. They seems to cut the weight in half for each hole.

dgs
04-10-2011, 04:39 PM
Between jacking up the rear of the car, load leveler, and using my rolling dollies on the trans tail shaft, I think it will work out nicely.

Anyone have a reason not to go with Grundy insurance. They seem to look like a good deal and are 1/2 the price of going through USAA.:eek:

I love USAA for my regular car insurance, but the folks who do their classic insurance aren't good. Pricey and the same restrictions as Hagarty.

I too have JCTaylor, as does my Dad and my gradfather did when he owned my 'Bird (and Dad's '56, and Dad's '57 Eldorado and a '37 Cord for a time). Good prices (I pay around $150/yr. for my car valued at $20K) and they do not have those restrictions, just don't drive it as a replacement car.